Oh Snap! A Steering Upgrade Options & Considerations Write-Up

[MadMan4BamaNATL]

Agreed.
What I did was avoid BroncBuster stolen bandaid ideas at all costs...

I dove in and bought the FIRST 3.0 rack with HD tie rods so I would never need tie rod braces.

I created a way to program the new racks on 2.0 Broncos, even though Ford could NOT do it themselves. my intention was to provide thos knowledge for FREE to contribute to the Bronco community in some small way.

fast forward a few months and the OPs favorite vendor is now of course selling Ford performance racks with the programming hack I CREATED. This should make people sick inside.
Additionally, the lies and misinformation spread by these fools about the competition is even more retarded. I mean, Tyler actually compared his testing skills to Loren Healy, ROFL...

Read whatever and believe what you want, but remember this, I'm not selling anything. I don't make a profit helping folks understand Broncos, I do it for free.

Hopefully people are smart enough and can read between all the lies and BS.

Click bait videos, horrible driving technique, break more to get clicks attitude, how much profit can I make off someone else's idea??? That's the BB trend.

Thanks POPO for showing your such a savvy BB follower.

I know you did brother. Been following that other thread you’re in on the progress of this topic and you guys have been working on it for well over a year I think.

Hey, also, my bad for very stupidly leaving off your name of my helpful member call out. I honestly feel bad about it, so I apologize. You’ve been at ground zero of this and other key mods the entire time. I appreciate your input in posts.

Yeah, BroncBuster and the YouTuber crowd are sort of dangerous, as accountability is lacking in that medium. Sure they have comment sections, but far too easy for them to delete anything critical and I just feel forums are more detailed and impactful. Shifting through the noise can be a chore at times, bur when the guys with knowledge chime in, I listen and wish everyone would.

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[Snacktime]

I know you did brother. Been following that other thread you’re in on the progress of this topic and you guys have been working on it for well over a year I think.

Hey, also, my bad for very stupidly leaving off your name of my helpful member call out. I honestly feel bad about it, so I apologize. You’ve been at ground zero of this and other key mods the entire time. I appreciate your input in posts.

Yeah, BroncBuster and the YouTuber crowd are sort of dangerous, as accountability is lacking in that medium. Sure they have comment sections, but far too easy for them to delete anything critical and I just feel forums are more detailed and impactful. Shifting through the noise can be a chore at times, bur when the guys with knowledge chime in, I listen and wish everyone would.

Amen! I just wish I had the attention span not to go off topic.

 

[87-Z28]

The cosine of small angles is very close to 1.0. Thus the arc swept by the half shafts produces small axial changes in length along the half shaft / FDU axis. Cosine of +/- 18 degree OEM CV limits results in only 5% axial compressive motion or about 5/8” for the roughly 12.5” long half shafts. Increasing angles >20 degrees will begin to more rapidly (non linear) exasperate the axial motion. A diff drop helps to counteract this effect.

 

[Az_Squatch_Bronco]

I have been reading and watching a lot of video on guys who are describing issues with the stock steering rack.

Guys like BB are running 40s on spacers, which I feel is the extreme side since the fact he is running spacers that tells me he is taking short cuts in his build. He is also pushing body lifts, which I think is horrible idea for any off road vehicles.

I also see guys having issues with racks running lifts that do not include coil overs. I may be wrong, but it seems a lift with coil over would help in keeping the geometry more in line than lifts without.

I am currently running 37s on a FabTech 3" Coil over lift and have their tie rods on order. I am wondering if the tie rod upgrade is really worth it? Time will tell how long my stock steering racks lasts I guess.

 

[Snacktime]

I have been reading and watching a lot of video on guys who are describing issues with the stock steering rack.

Guys like BB are running 40s on spacers, which I feel is the extreme side since the fact he is running spacers that tells me he is taking short cuts in his build. He is also pushing body lifts, which I think is horrible idea for any off road vehicles.

I also see guys having issues with racks running lifts that do not include coil overs. I may be wrong, but it seems a lift with coil over would help in keeping the geometry more in line than lifts without.

I am currently running 37s on a FabTech 3" Coil over lift and have their tie rods on order. I am wondering if the tie rod upgrade is really worth it? Time will tell how long my stock steering racks lasts I guess.

@Az_Squatch_Bronco short answer is yes you should take some steps to strengthen your steering rack. @popo_patty did a good job laying out the options. I would just start with the rough country bushings, if you see your stock bushings are hammer then you qualify for the next level of parts.

Long answer is @87-Z28 has been working to put together a lot of the angle and binding information in graphical manner. What once started as a tie rod issue has come full circle to include cv axles. Several of us are working through this with different theories as this is a new platform. More angle, the more stress and math becomes a huge tool to give some sort of factor of strength. I would poke through this thread its one of my favorites! Especially the graphs on page 4.

https://www.bronco6g.com/forum/thre...on-calculations-and-measurements.73917/page-4

 

[popo_patty]

@Az_Squatch_Bronco short answer is yes you should take some steps to strengthen your steering rack. @popo_patty did a good job laying out the options. I would just start with the rough country bushings, if you see your stock bushings are hammer then you qualify for the next level of parts.

Long answer is @87-Z28 has been working to put together a lot of the angle and binding information in graphical manner. What once started as a tie rod issue has come full circle to include cv axles. Several of us are working through this with different theories as this is a new platform. More angle, the more stress and math becomes a huge tool to give some sort of factor of strength. I would poke through this thread its one of my favorites! Especially the graphs on page 4.

https://www.bronco6g.com/forum/thre...on-calculations-and-measurements.73917/page-4

^^^ this. Lots of good stuff coming from that group and I look forward to it.

 

[LCW]

Exactly
the tie rod is a 20 min fix on the trail and it becomes the fuse able link if you will.
I did the 3”zone on my 22 w/t sas @49 miles
Did the BB kit all 3 at 700 miles. The stock 2.0 had signs of wear on the PS seal here is mine look at the seam in the pot metal then zoom in on the seal to see the deformation this is with 37’s for 651 miles 35’s49 miles imho the stock rack needs the BB or any variation of a new end cap as all of the tie rod force is transmitted upwards into the housing
Looking at the weld74 stg 1 kit for a friend the only thing I don’t like is the snap ring to hold the bushing in. I like the press in bushing of the BB referencing the pass side cap
T

What list of tools is needed for a trail-side tie rod replacement? Fairly large crowfoot I imagine. Boots held on with oetiker clamps from factory?

 

[popo_patty]

What list of tools is needed for a trail-side tie rod replacement? Fairly large crowfoot I imagine. Boots held on with oetiker clamps from factory?

21mm for the tie rod ball joint and a very large crescent wrench for the inner portion. A long bladed, thin flat head will remove the factory clamp with a good wack on the joint portion from a hammer. Super easy relatively speaking. BJ side May spin when tightening to a crescent wrench can help reattach.
Needle nose pliers too and a hose clamp for the new tie rod

 

[userdude]

The cosine of small angles is very close to 1.0. Thus the arc swept by the half shafts produces small axial changes in length along the half shaft / FDU axis. Cosine of +/- 18 degree OEM CV limits results in only 5% axial compressive motion or about 5/8” for the roughly 12.5” long half shafts. Increasing angles >20 degrees will begin to more rapidly (non linear) exasperate the axial motion. A diff drop helps to counteract this effect.

What he said.

 

[5GENIDN]

I know you did brother. Been following that other thread you’re in on the progress of this topic and you guys have been working on it for well over a year I think.

Hey, also, my bad for very stupidly leaving off your name of my helpful member call out. I honestly feel bad about it, so I apologize. You’ve been at ground zero of this and other key mods the entire time. I appreciate your input in posts.

Yeah, BroncBuster and the YouTuber crowd are sort of dangerous, as accountability is lacking in that medium. Sure they have comment sections, but far too easy for them to delete anything critical and I just feel forums are more detailed and impactful. Shifting through the noise can be a chore at times, bur when the guys with knowledge chime in, I listen and wish everyone would.

I am listening to you. and the others you are referring to... I have taken my time to sit and read over a long time before ever posting.... If someone as slow as I am takes the time we can weed through it all.... Those that do not take the time will listen to whomever talks the loudest.

I like that you are speaking up.

 

[5GENIDN]

The cosine of small angles is very close to 1.0. Thus the arc swept by the half shafts produces small axial changes in length along the half shaft / FDU axis. Cosine of +/- 18 degree OEM CV limits results in only 5% axial compressive motion or about 5/8” for the roughly 12.5” long half shafts. Increasing angles >20 degrees will begin to more rapidly (non linear) exasperate the axial motion. A diff drop helps to counteract this effect.

I love trigonometry!

 

[Az_Squatch_Bronco]

@Az_Squatch_Bronco short answer is yes you should take some steps to strengthen your steering rack. @popo_patty did a good job laying out the options. I would just start with the rough country bushings, if you see your stock bushings are hammer then you qualify for the next level of parts.

Long answer is @87-Z28 has been working to put together a lot of the angle and binding information in graphical manner. What once started as a tie rod issue has come full circle to include cv axles. Several of us are working through this with different theories as this is a new platform. More angle, the more stress and math becomes a huge tool to give some sort of factor of strength. I would poke through this thread its one of my favorites! Especially the graphs on page 4.

https://www.bronco6g.com/forum/thre...on-calculations-and-measurements.73917/page-4

I should have taken a picture before the lift, however, I think the angle is pretty close to stock if I remember correctly.

I am probably not wheeling as much as i did years ago when I had my Jeep JK and XJ, certainly not going to be doing the trails I did in my highly modified XJ. I traded a 2023 Rubicon for the Bronco for many reasons, one being comfort - and doing more moderate trails now.

 

[mcinfantry]

21mm for the tie rod ball joint and a very large crescent wrench for the inner portion. A long bladed, thin flat head will remove the factory clamp with a good wack on the joint portion from a hammer. Super easy relatively speaking. BJ side May spin when tightening to a crescent wrench can help reattach.
Needle nose pliers too and a hose clamp for the new tie rod

Actually you can recrimp the factory oetickers on both sides

I did. Long flat screwdriver and a pex crimper

no need for a hose clamp

 

[Heckler]

How much lift do you have?

Great write up. So far the HOSS 3.0 is holding up well (WT 2023) on stock rig. Will bookmark this post for the future.

 

[Snacktime]

I should have taken a picture before the lift, however, I think the angle is pretty close to stock if I remember correctly.

I am probably not wheeling as much as i did years ago when I had my Jeep JK and XJ, certainly not going to be doing the trails I did in my highly modified XJ. I traded a 2023 Rubicon for the Bronco for many reasons, one being comfort - and doing more moderate trails now.

Problem is that one rock, you know that one you don't see. The stock bushing just can't handle the stress and deforms. Now you are just slowly doing more damage over time. This was one of the local broncos that I helped install some Rough Country bushings in. He was definitely on borrowed time! Steering issues are usually related to lift and tires but bronco are susceptible from birth.

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