Tuning Options?

[ginettacar12]

Been waiting to see what power the ProCal tune was making before making a decision what tuner to go with but also trying to make sense of the various power numbers out there. Here's what I'm figuring from info available. Calculated values are with 24% drivetrain loss.

Stock - 418 bhp (crank), 315-323 bhp (wheel - dyno numbers),
440 lb-ft (crank) 334-370 lb-ft (wheel - dyno numbers)

ProCal Tune - 455 bhp (crank assumed), 345bhp (wheel calculated)
536 lb-ft (crank assumed) 407 lb-ft (wheel calculated)

5Star ECU Swap - 459bhp (wheel) approx. 569bhp (crank calculated)
541 lb-ft (wheel) approx. 670 lb-ft (crank calculated)
S&B Intake 490 bhp- 500bhp (wheel), approx. 608bhp (crank calculated)
562 lb-ft (wheel), approx. 696 ft-lb (crank)

Livernois ECU Swap - 435bhp (wheel), approx. 543bhp (crank calculated)
468 lb-ft (wheel), approx. 580 lb-ft (crank calculated)

ZFG ECU Swap (75bhp / 75lb-ft) - approx. 390bhp (wheel), approx. 484bhp (crank calculated)
approx. 450 lb-ft (wheel), approx. 558 lb-ft (crank calculated)

Is 5 Star really getting that kind of power, is their dyno on crack or is my math not mathing? The 500bhp number at the wheels is right from SVTPerformance video with the S&B CAI added.

Also the ZFG numbers mentioned on their website (+75bhp) versus video posted on the forum with much bigger gains (+131bhp) are clearly different.

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[Ducati1098]

The numbers on ZFG’s website were just estimations put there before any Bronco tuning/dyno had been done.

@Spooled and ZFG made 488 on 93 and 553 on E50
5 star made 466 on 93 and 500 on boostane
Both of those are with an intake.

 

[ginettacar12]

The numbers on ZFG’s website were just estimations put there before any Bronco tuning/dyno had been done.

@Spooled and ZFG made 488 on 93 and 553 on E50
5 star made 466 on 93 and 500 on boostane
Both of those are with an intake.

Thanks @Ducati1098 for the further info. So both ZFG and 5Star are making serious increases on 93 and much more than the ProCal tune. Looks like this is the way to go for me, along with an S&B CAI and Cobb intercooler.

 

[Ducati1098]

Thanks @Ducati1098 for the further info. So both ZFG and 5Star are making serious increases on 93 and much more than the ProCal tune. Looks like this is the way to go for me, along with an S&B CAI and Cobb intercooler.

100%
Either one are far more hp for your money.
I personally went with ZFG for my non-raptor because the tuning was available first, and it’s an absolute blast to drive.

 

[RowsKing]

What about the Whipple tune?

 

[Ducati1098]

What about the Whipple tune?

That’s very similar to the procal. Slightly different numbers.

 

[RowsKing]

That’s very similar to the procal. Slightly different numbers.

Procal is crank and Whipple is to the wheels tho right?

I want to see the procal on the dyno asap.

 

[Ducati1098]

Procal is crank and Whipple is to the wheels tho right?

I want to see the procal on the dyno asap.

No. They’re both rated at the crank.
Watch any Whipple Braptor dyno video and you’ll see they aren’t making the advertised power to the wheels.

 

[ginettacar12]

For Whipple tune

Lethal Performance / Palm Beach Dyno showing 296 bhp / 342 lb-ft stock (wheel),
5 Star showing 367bhp / 403 lb-ft stock (wheel) so something is off between the videos.

PBD Whipple tune showing 347bhp / 395 lb-ft
5 Star Whipple tune showing 423bhp / 473 lb-ft (with Boostane)

The PBD numbers just don't look right. If the 5 Star numbers are accurate (torque looks high for stock) then the Whipple tune is a little higher performance than the ProCal.

 

[swamp2]

Standard wheel roller dynos are not able to produce comparable results shop to shop, day to day, let alone across rigs and mods. Even under ideal care and conditions they can't accurately not definitively measure small gains like those delivered from many mods. Even strap down variation causes large swings in power.

Add to this confusion regarding true losses vs drivetrain intertia effects and unfortunately, these "tools" are barely effective.

 

[RIDE]

Thanks @Ducati1098 for the further info. So both ZFG and 5Star are making serious increases on 93 and much more than the ProCal tune. Looks like this is the way to go for me, along with an S&B CAI and Cobb intercooler.

@Ducati1098 or @Spooled if you had to guess, how much add’l gains could also adding bigger pipes to this setup get? Worth it? Or no

 

[Ducati1098]

@Ducati1098 or @Spooled if you had to guess, how much add’l gains could also adding bigger pipes to this setup get? Worth it? Or no

Intercooler pipes? Without a custom tune they’re probably not worth it at all. Even with one I doubt there are significant gains.

 

[RIDE]

Intercooler pipes? Without a custom tune they’re probably not worth it at all. Even with one I doubt there are significant gains.

Exhaust, and specifically from downpipe back. Theoretically,
I’ve dual residency in a state where glass packs and nothing else is acceptable so it’d be theoretically possible. Theoretically. I realize tricking the PCM to be okay without a cat may kill the dream.

 

[Ducati1098]

Exhaust, and specifically from downpipe back. Theoretically,
I’ve dual residency in a state where glass packs and nothing else is acceptable so it’d be theoretically possible. Theoretically. I realize tricking the PCM to be okay without a cat may kill the dream.

It’s tough to say without any evidence to back it up. I don’t have a Braptor, and those are obviously different. But from what I’ve seen with the 2.7’s the downpipes don’t seem to pick up much power. The rest of the exhaust may be more beneficial, but still not likely to pick up a lot.

 

[RIDE]

It’s tough to say without any evidence to back it up. I don’t have a Braptor, and those are obviously different. But from what I’ve seen with the 2.7’s the downpipes don’t seem to pick up much power. The rest of the exhaust may be more beneficial, but still not likely to pick up a lot.

Appreciate the input. I buy and hold my trucks and once my extended warranty runs out, whatever acceptable addons not already upgraded, I plan to add. As I do with all my other trucks, goal will be entire kit of cold air intake, intercooler, exhaust, tune, and am hoping by then Whipple (or equivalent) has a bigger supercharger to at least consider. Not looking to race, but am a student of getting max horses/torque out, but only to an economically efficient extent. Once I’m there, I’m good.

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