How can water enter the engine?

[Silver-Bolt]

How steep of an angle was the Bronco sitting in the water? Was it steep enough that the oil pick up was sucking air while it ran?

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[broncabilly]

How steep of an angle was the Bronco sitting in the water? Was it steep enough that the oil pick up was sucking air while it ran?

Not crazy, judging by the water line pic it might have been what, 20-25%? And given that it now had an extra amount of water in the oil I'd say it was pretty full lol.

 

[MadMan4BamaNATL]

There were photos, posts, et al in this other thread ... which, as it appears, were later edited away.

https://www.bronco6g.com/forum/threads/how-tough-is-this-thing.79465/

Sorry OP for your troubles but it does seem like there is an attempt at narrative building going on here.

Well lookie there, ain’t that something…….

Thanks for sharing that; helps with my suspicions. Think we’re done here.

 

[broncabilly]

Well lookie there, ain’t that something…….

Thanks for sharing that; helps with my suspicions. Think we’re done here.

We are clearly done here. Haven't had a worthwhile or helpful post in a few pages. At the time of that post the only thing wrong was the alternator. Somebody actually helped and pointed to a TSB. Try to imagine what it must be like to be helpful!

 

[Az_Squatch_Bronco]

We are clearly done here. Haven't had a worthwhile or helpful post in a few pages. At the time of that post the only thing wrong was the alternator. Somebody actually helped and pointed to a TSB. Try to imagine what it must be like to be helpful!

I think you have learned a valuable lesson about "off-road" driving.

I cant even begin to speculate without seeing the deleted pictures...I mean why delete them unless they support Fords claim.

Rookie mistakes were made...

 

[Merc4x4]

We are clearly done here. Haven't had a worthwhile or helpful post in a few pages. At the time of that post the only thing wrong was the alternator. Somebody actually helped and pointed to a TSB. Try to imagine what it must be like to be helpful!

I guess I'm the only person on here to have water sucked into an engine, not via intake?
Vehicle: 1991 Eagle Talon TSI AWD (with 4G63 turbo 4-cyl)
Story:
Living on NC coast for a while I've been through a couple hurricanes. I was at a hurricane party and for lack of better judgement I decided to drive home. Made it most of the way until the car died in a deep puddle. Fearing bent rods I waded my way home.
I towed or dragged the car home next day or two. It was a long time ago and some details are forgotten.
Oil was filled with water. Changed oil, probably pulled plugs and bumped it a bit.
Engine started right up. Sounded better than before the water. No mechanical damage.
Drove the car a couple more years. Gave it to my sister who drove it for a few years, then let it sit in a field for a few more. Took it back and gave it to my fried who drove it a few years.

I would have expected some damage to the engine if enough water was ingested to cause it to stop running. Most likely water was interfering with the ignition/battery/alternator.

My theory was/is the cooling engine decreases the internal pressure causing a vacuum. Since the engine was 1/2 way underwater, water was pulled in through all the seals.

Later on when I got into wheeling, I heard never shut off your engine when stuck in water. I figured the pressure change pulling in water through the seals was the reason why.

The water I got stuck in was not muddy. I imagine all kinds of silt was sucked into the engine oil along with the water. That seems like it would easily chew up a bearing.

I'm not sure what I'd do if I got stuck in muddy water and had to turn off the engine (or it shut off), but this is the reason I avoid splashing through mud puddles, even if is fun. I'd start with lots of oil and filter changes. The first might not even stay in there until the engine reaches operating temps for the first time. I don't want to replace this engine until a (fully functional) Coyote swap is available.

 

[OX1]

Apparently you didn’t see the picture of the airbox with a few splatters of water in it and the clean filter. Look at that water and tell me it wouldn’t leave an actual water line in the air box? Or on the filter. Or the air intake tube that didn’t have one sign of water entry. But I’m wasting my time. Think what you want to think. As I’ve said, others have been helpful and I’m thankful for that.

Try not to take to heart some of these people that have NEVER been mudding, who are scared to death to hit a widdle mud hole, never actually got water in an air filter or intake, never got muddy water in an airbox, actually think an oil seal needs to be leaking to get water bypassed into a sealed oil repository, etc...

The best comment is why were you sitting in a mudhole so long. Well, lunch of course, DUH!!!

If Ford really put a crank case breather tube down the front of the engine, which could at times be under vacuum (assuming), that could be your answer. Certainly much easier route to get water in the oil than an air intake.

We just went through this @ AOAA with an EFI 460 89 bronc (on 42's), that still had the air intake in the stockish EFI460 location. The entire intake tract was filled with muddy water (air cleaner was covered inside and out with muddy water, and even only running a couple seconds, started sucking in on itself).

One side of the engine, 3 out of 4 cyl's had some dirt and/or water in them. We pulled all the plugs, dumped some oil in cyl's and cranked engine until it spit everything out the spark plugs holes. Anyway, no water in the oil, didn't even have to change it.

4:46 you can see water over a 44 (to get an idea of depth). 7:20 starts the extraction.



Here's how you get water in your oil, if you really want too.
(yes, did this on purpose, but when someone gives you two broncos
for $300, what's a guy to do. It was almost 20 years ago, when FSB's were
worth nothing) .

 

[mcinfantry]

I’ve filled a 53 m38a1 f134 with water and here’s a functioning snorkel on a Cummins 4bt…..

I said it in an earlier post. The filter in the photo has never seen a drop of water…. But then again is that the filter that was on it when it sunk?

 

[broncabilly]

It’s the original filter, all you have is my word on it. And I posted before but this is the original air tube leading from it

The most frustrating thing is the dealer isn’t letting me talk to the mechanic that said it inhaled water, or the field engineer that is supposed to look at it. Or rather strongly suggesting that it would hurt my case. My thoughts are that they NEED to know the circumstances to know they have to dig deeper. If they knew it ran fine but there was water in the oil then they might try harder. I guess they don’t care because it’s not their $10,000 on the line.

 

[OX1]

I’ve filled a 53 m38a1 f134 with water and here’s a functioning snorkel on a Cummins 4bt…..

I said it in an earlier post. The filter in the photo has never seen a drop of water…. But then again is that the filter that was on it when it sunk?

Well, if f you do this all the time, with some rigs un-snorkled, you know that airbox of the OP is pretty darn clean, when you are talking the realm of water and muddy water airbox/intake ingestion.

Where is the water line in the airbox? (if there is one, it is on the very bottom of air cleaner box) Why isn't the entire inside of airbox covered in at least a muddy water stain. The fact that there are a ton of very small muddy water "stain" spots all over inside of airbox, tells you it did not get "swamped" by any means, not even close.

Not sure what swapping air cleaners gets you, "sympathy" from internet wheelers? Does that get you a warrantee claim vs not getting sympathy? Could be OP just got tired of dumb comments about being "too abusive offroad", with a companies supposed premier offroad vehicle (which happens constantly on this board)...........

 

[OX1]

It’s the original filter, all you have is my word on it. And I posted before but this is the original air tube leading from it

The most frustrating thing is the dealer isn’t letting me talk to the mechanic that said it inhaled water, or the field engineer that is supposed to look at it. Or rather strongly suggesting that it would hurt my case. My thoughts are that they NEED to know the circumstances to know they have to dig deeper. If they knew it ran fine but there was water in the oil then they might try harder. I guess they don’t care because it’s not their $10,000 on the line.

Sorry, but Ford has and will deny coverage for a lot less. Almost 100% chance you are not getting that covered, no matter what really happened.

 

[flip]

There isn't enough in the air filter housing that would lead me to believe water ingestion on the top end. The filter would show signs of collapse and the inlet tube doesn't have any spotting in it. Still, anything on the top end would've likely ended in a bent rod and immediate seizure. If there was water in the inlet side there will be some in the intercooler or evidence thereof.

Eliminating water through the top end as the cause of failure does not rule out what Ford would call abuse/misuse because it was sill submerged. If a block, head, head gasket is eliminated by pressure testing the cooling system, it will still be a customer pay repair. If it fails a pressure test and borescope shows evidence of coolant in a cylinder, there's strong case to make for it to be covered. Same needs to happen with the oil cooler and turbo as both of these have coolant and oil in close proximity.

 

[Bmadda]

Many years ago buddy of mine got his '80 FSB stuck bad in a really deep mud hole, and he had made the mistake of wheeling solo w/passengers. After hours of trying to get it out, and calling everyone w/a 4x4 that he could reach to help, he had no choice but to leave it sit overnight. Now this was a MUCH higher mileage 302, but that is exactly what happened to him. Overnight the oil pan filled w/water seeping in from either the rear main or front seal or both. Next day we got it recovered, but the oil was filled w/water. It took at least 3x 5qt drain pan loads to drain it. The engine did run ok after that, but never had acceptable oil pressure again. He ended up getting it rebuilt some months later, but w/the miles it already had, it was pretty tired to begin with. All those old windsors leaked at least a little oil, and the golden rule of fluids (I guess) is if it can leak out, it can also leak in!

 

[P52Ranch]

Many years ago buddy of mine got his '80 FSB stuck bad in a really deep mud hole, and he had made the mistake of wheeling solo w/passengers. After hours of trying to get it out, and calling everyone w/a 4x4 that he could reach to help, he had no choice but to leave it sit overnight. Now this was a MUCH higher mileage 302, but that is exactly what happened to him. Overnight the oil pan filled w/water seeping in from either the rear main or front seal or both. Next day we got it recovered, but the oil was filled w/water. It took at least 3x 5qt drain pan loads to drain it. The engine did run ok after that, but never had acceptable oil pressure again. He ended up getting it rebuilt some months later, but w/the miles it already had, it was pretty tired to begin with. All those old windsors leaked at least a little oil, and the golden rule of fluids (I guess) is if it can leak out, it can also leak in!

This^^^^^
Everyone in this post has been quoting "water fording depth". That is not going to be the same as "water parking depth". Especially a hot engine that is rapidly cooling down because it was shutdown while partially submerged.

 

[Az_Squatch_Bronco]

Please post the original picture...Ford already denied you so theres nothing to lose!!

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