How can water enter the engine?

[broncabilly]

I'm not an engine/intake expert by any means, but if I were on a jury and saw that picture I would assign you 99% of the blame. Just saying.

Thanks for your opinion. Based on what, for real? A couple drops of water in the air box? If water that dirty was high enough to get past the filter, wouldn't there be a water line in the box?
I would bet that many Bronco owners have boxes that look like that. The paper on the air filter is pristine. Could I have changed it? Sure, but I didn't.

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[broncabilly]

The only possibility I can see is a leak in the tubes going to and from the charge air cooler. It was under water if the water was over the bumper. If a tube was loose or off, the engine should have been a dog and CEL should have been on. How did engine run when you first started it? Did it run funny at all driving home? If water got into CAC, it would have laid in there until engine was loaded and running at a higher RPM, then the higher air flow would have drawn it into the engine. If CAC has a leak, it would be covered under warranty and so would engine as consequential damage. Leakage at the CAC also would not have gotten the air filter wet.

I agree with this as a potential possibility. They don't seem interested, they've determined it HAD to go through the air filter, perhaps because the other possibilities are less convenient for them. I just don't know what to do next. I've requested that the dealer ask a Ford Field Engineer to come out and talk to them. Ford Client Relationships say they have absolutely nothing to do with warranty work and there is nobody to talk to who does have something to do with it.

 

[broncabilly]

So to clarify, you had water get into the oil pan somehow, but NOT the cylinders? Oil came out looking like a wendy's frosty kinda? Or did you have to pull spark plugs to clear hydrolocked cylinders?

By the time it seized up the water had made it's way through the entire engine including the cylinders. almost Immediately after being towed out, I discovered the frosty situation and went and bought new oil and changed it. The wrench I bought didn't work on the filter, I then had it towed. I actually don't know the cause of the seizing, I can't imagine at that point it hydrolocked as the oil had been changed multiple times. More likely parts wore down from sand that got in with the water.

 

[BadlandsA51]

By the time it seized up the water had made it's way through the entire engine including the cylinders. almost Immediately after being towed out, I discovered the frosty situation and went and bought new oil and changed it. The wrench I bought didn't work on the filter, I then had it towed. I actually don't know the cause of the seizing, I can't imagine at that point it hydrolocked as the oil had been changed multiple times. More likely parts wore down from sand that got in with the water.

A hydro lock happens in the cylinders, there would not be a lot of water in the crankcase right away, it would have to leak down past the rings. If it hydro locked the water definitely came in through the intake. So, when you tried to start it after getting pulled out of water, would it crank or did the starter stall?

 

[Bmadda]

By the time it seized up the water had made it's way through the entire engine including the cylinders. almost Immediately after being towed out, I discovered the frosty situation and went and bought new oil and changed it. The wrench I bought didn't work on the filter, I then had it towed. I actually don't know the cause of the seizing, I can't imagine at that point it hydrolocked as the oil had been changed multiple times. More likely parts wore down from sand that got in with the water.

I have some experience w/hydrolock, and basically the way it works is this...as soon as the engine draws enough water to hit the spark plugs it shuts off instantly...at that point the engine is likely undamaged. The damage happens when the driver attempts to restart it. The starter motor on most engines has enough torque to bend a connecting rod, or crush a rod bearing when it forces the piston into a hydrolocked cylinder. If this had happened, you woulda had to pull the spark plugs to get it running again. I have also seen enough water in the oil pan to "wash out" the bearings, but changing it shoulda saved it. It sounds like the second scenario is what you describe. Here's a pick of an old 4.0L filter that got hydrolocked on a trail. We DID get this engine running again, and the driver never touched the key after it stalled. Drove it several more years after this incident!

NOW THAT'S HYDROLOCKED!

 

[broncabilly]

A hydro lock happens in the cylinders, there would not be a lot of water in the crankcase right away, it would have to leak down past the rings. If it hydro locked the water definitely came in through the intake. So, when you tried to start it after getting pulled out of water, would it crank or did the starter stall?

It was not hydrolocked. It ran completely fine until rough idle 20 minutes later. A large amount of water came out with the oil change done right after the water was discovered in the oil. Besides the obvious of me knowing it didn't go in the air intake because I was there, this all points to it entering somewhere other than the top of the engine.

 

[flip]

If it didn't come in through the air cleaner box, which is almost always the case, you have an intercooler pipe leaking. A shop should be able to smoke test for a leak but I'll almost guarantee that's the point of entry. Only other option is oil fill cap or dipstick. Everything else is essentially a "sealed" system. Water only in the oil is going to be an internal engine failure (coolant level will have dropped) or fill cap/dipstick. Could possibly be a bad turbo where fluids could mix but again, coolant level in the overflow would show a drop.

 

[BadlandsA51]

It was not hydrolocked. It ran completely fine until rough idle 20 minutes later. A large amount of water came out with the oil change done right after the water was discovered in the oil. Besides the obvious of me knowing it didn't go in the air intake because I was there, this all points to it entering somewhere other than the top of the engine.

Yep, I’ve seen a couple of engines suck up stuff they shouldn’t too. Anyway, how over full was the crankcase? A little or a lot?

 

[Bmadda]

It was not hydrolocked. It ran completely fine until rough idle 20 minutes later. A large amount of water came out with the oil change done right after the water was discovered in the oil. Besides the obvious of me knowing it didn't go in the air intake because I was there, this all points to it entering somewhere other than the top of the engine.

I believe you...looking at the picture you posted NFW that thing was hydrolocked, unless a charge pipe was loose or busted etc, which then why didn't the dealership send you a pic of that? You never mentioned which engine 2.3 or 2.7?

 

[DefNotBuddyLee]

I'm with camp intercooler. I think someone saw indications of moisture in the air box and went straight to that conclusion (which is reasonable). Agree with @flip to smoke test for the leak.

 

[broncabilly]

I believe you...looking at the picture you posted NFW that thing was hydrolocked, unless a charge pipe was loose or busted etc, which then why didn't the dealership send you a pic of that? You never mentioned which engine 2.3 or 2.7?

I've got a few pictures. Not sure what a charge pipe looks like. I'll look into it. 2.3

 

[flip]

I've got a few pictures. Not sure what a charge pipe looks like. I'll look into it. 2.3

Does it still crank over? If so, you might be able to do a compression test to see if one of the rods is bent. If bent rod, it came in through the intake. The link I posted in one of my replies was my '21 after going through a couple mud holes at a local park. Mine had water and mud in it with some water droplets in the first couple inches of the tube exiting the filter box. It only takes an ounce or two in a short period of time to bend a rod.

 

[broncabilly]

I've got a few pictures. Not sure what a charge pipe looks like. I'll look into it. 2.3

I've got google too, don't work too hard
Thanks for the info, I have passed that along to the dealer

Does it still crank over? If so, you might be able to do a compression test to see if one of the rods is bent. If bent rod, it came in through the intake. The link I posted in one of my replies was my '21 after going through a couple mud holes at a local park. Mine had water and mud in it with some water droplets in the first couple inches of the tube exiting the filter box. It only takes an ounce or two in a short period of time to bend a rod.

Nah, it seized up back on page 1
I think there was enough sediment in with the water to tear things up pretty good.

 

[huey]

keep us posted!
Hopefully you get it covered, in the meantime I'm going to check my charge tubes and make sure they are seated properly

 

[Bmadda]

I've got a few pictures. Not sure what a charge pipe looks like. I'll look into it. 2.3

The oil separator/pcv is on the dr side of the block on a 2.3...kinda low really. That would be my prime suspect I guess.

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