Damage while using winch on improperly installed Rough Country High Mount

[BAUS67]

Hi all, I want to verify an assumption I have. The things outlined in red are the/any bumper. Not related to the additional mounting brackets discussed in this thread. Is this accurate? Thank you.

Everything white and grey are OEM.


The pieces in teal/green/blue are the aftermarket "add ons".

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[murphtron]

Thx. Answers the question! Such a great nerdy thread

 

[BAUS67]

We needed some new excitement, we can only have so many "what trim should I pick" and "how to fit 37s" and "I color matched my shackles" threads.

Had to find a place for the "cool kids" to hang out.

 

[BAUS67]

Thx. Answers the question! Such a great nerdy thread

Technically your one red line goes around the teal part. The other goes through the grey part I answered that way so I had the bases covered.

 

[22Wildtrak]

Ohhhh... yeah. That makes more sense—don't know why that didn't occur to me.

Definitely sucks, and it confirms my fears. One of the reasons why I've been hesitant about the JCR mount is for the same reason. I had a feeling if you got a winch pull at the right angle you could bend something.

Just seems like a complete bumper replacement is the right way to go so you don't create a level-type setup that'll bend the front end. I just haven't seen an aftermarket bumper I really liked yet.

Yeah understand not happy with JCR service or products anymore

 

[zuke]

Both brackets have the bolt running all the way through the frame, so neither would see a single shear load. The extra frame bolt on the top bracket doesn't make it a double shear, they're both technically double shear. For example, a trailer hitch pin is in double shear, while a hitch ball is in single shear...the discrepancy in diameter of the two for the same load rating does a great job of explaining why double shear is a stronger design.

I was looking at the LOD Install instructions, and they aren't double shear at all, they are using 4 bolts and nuts into the frame rails per side...

https://lodoffroad.com/assets/pdfs/BFT2100 Bronco 2021 Front Bumper Frame Tie Brackets.pdf

Also, the area of the frame they are bolting into is part of the frames crush zone. Has anyone looked at the thickness of the frame horns themselves up there? (I haven't yet)

I'm undecided if I would want to do these double shear anyway, but If I did, I would drill a 1" hole through the frame rail,, and weld in a piece of something fairly sturdy (Pipe) in the hole, because if you do put a double shear bolt through a crushable part of the frame like this, you'll badly deform the frame rails when you tighten it.

It also doesn't look like it will be easy to add any kind of single substantial gusset to each bracket with the number of bolts that are going into each plate, so multiple smaller gussets might be the way to win the day.

In any case, I'm not going to be tackling this right away, But I probably will next winter, in the meantime, I look forward to seeing what everyone else comes up with.

 

[Tricky Dick]

Also, the area of the frame they are bolting into is part of the frames crush zone. Has anyone looked at the thickness of the frame horns themselves up there? (I haven't yet)

I'm undecided if I would want to do these double shear anyway, but If I did, I would drill a 1" hole through the frame rail,, and weld in a piece of something fairly sturdy (Pipe) in the hole, because if you do put a double shear bolt through a crushable part of the frame like this, you'll badly deform the frame rails when you tighten it.

This guy knows what's up.

I won't be sleeving and through bolting, but I will add some welds. A brace back to the bash plate mounts like Ford uses seems very important too to help with the crush zones.

 

[‘21OBX]

I don't think it would matter but maybe? I might have only bent that inner ear.



It miiight be just the plates. I won't know until it's apart.

Vivid Racing has the LoD brackets in stock, I just ordered a set.

You’ll have to cut the LOD reinforcements. They don’t fit with the MOD bumper in the stock form. I installed them when I did my RC mount. The bolts they send lookk like the cheapest you can get. I re used the ford bolts. At least they have a rating stamped on them. The lower loop hits the bumper when trying to install. Unless they changed the design. I still feel they were a good addition. I can’t for the life of me believe JCR doesn’t have a reinforcement yet.
As for a complete replacement bumper a lot of them bolt to the same stock plates. So do have you cut the plates off and mount directly to the frame. I did not distort anything with the LOD brackets. And have winched myself and other over obstacles but they were not buried by any means. The ford reinforcement for their winch setup are far superior imo but I’m not sure they can be had separately. The bolts are shouldered on the ford setup so you can’t crush the frame when tightening.

 

[‘21OBX]

Also curious if the ford mount is that much better

Having owned and installed both YES. The ford mount plate is built better. The frame reinforcement is better and is heavy. But it comes at a steep price and you give up some approach angle vs the RC

 

[Tricky Dick]

You’ll have to cut the LOD reinforcements. They don’t fit with the MOD bumper in the stock form. I installed them when I did my RC mount. The bolts they send lookk like the cheapest you can get. I re used the ford bolts. At least they have a rating stamped on them. The lower loop hits the bumper when trying to install. Unless they changed the design. I still feel they were a good addition. I can’t for the life of me believe JCR doesn’t have a reinforcement yet.
As for a complete replacement bumper a lot of them bolt to the same stock plates. So do have you cut the plates off and mount directly to the frame. I did not distort anything with the LOD brackets. And have winched myself and other over obstacles but they were not buried by any means. The ford reinforcement for their winch setup are far superior imo but I’m not sure they can be had separately. The bolts are shouldered on the ford setup so you can’t crush the frame when tightening.

Thanks for the first hand info!

 

[‘21OBX]

I am waiting for my JCR to be delivered. The JCR bolts to the frame where the existing recover points are now. This shouldn't happen with the JCR. His looks to be bolted to the bumper and the bumper itself rotated. You should be fine.

The RC bolts to the exact same spot as the JCR.

 

[‘21OBX]

Thanks for the first hand info!

Not sure you have to cut this much off but was frustrated from trying to get the bumper back on with my son. So I zipped them off flush with the frame while bolted on.

 

[Tricky Dick]

Not sure you have to cut this much off but was frustrated from trying to get the bumper back on with my son. So I zipped them off flush with the frame while bolted on.

How thick are they? They look like only 1/8 or 3/16.

 

[BAUS67]

I was looking at the LOD Install instructions, and they aren't double shear at all, they are using 4 bolts and nuts into the frame rails per side...

https://lodoffroad.com/assets/pdfs/BFT2100 Bronco 2021 Front Bumper Frame Tie Brackets.pdf

Also, the area of the frame they are bolting into is part of the frames crush zone. Has anyone looked at the thickness of the frame horns themselves up there? (I haven't yet)

I'm undecided if I would want to do these double shear anyway, but If I did, I would drill a 1" hole through the frame rail,, and weld in a piece of something fairly sturdy (Pipe) in the hole, because if you do put a double shear bolt through a crushable part of the frame like this, you'll badly deform the frame rails when you tighten it.

It also doesn't look like it will be easy to add any kind of single substantial gusset to each bracket with the number of bolts that are going into each plate, so multiple smaller gussets might be the way to win the day.

In any case, I'm not going to be tackling this right away, But I probably will next winter, in the meantime, I look forward to seeing what everyone else comes up with.

I did not read the directions I took for granted they had you drill, sleeve and bolt through. So yeah, I think for the argument, it would be single shear, 4 times.

I took this when I was contemplating a plan of action when doing the IC. I would say same thickness all the way through.

I did look at it when I put my IC on. The frame has ridges/dimples in it as a crumple zone. I am not engineer but I can say that they look like crumple zones to me.

I took this pic because I have a JKS high clearance kit to put on and I needed to see how close it would be to my proposed winch mount bracket. The JKS kit goes to about the 4 1/2 inch mark in the pic, just after the second ridge/dimple back.

I know welding plates to this will not be a good thing if I get in a crash but I would rather have the peace of mind when I am in the woods using my winch to get me home than worry about how much damage it will do if I wreck the Bronc. That is just me. The Bronc is not a DD'er for me I have my F-150 for that.

 

[98infinity]

Was looking at the warn elite front bumper for the Bronco and the brackets tie in under the frame, wonder if this would help at all?

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