CV axle BUSTED

[Ducati1098]

So I don’t have the zone kit and have tried to reach out to zone regarding the height of their spacers (to which they said was propietary information). If you have the kit, measuring the spacers would be helpful as they do not look to be of equal sizing between the top hat and spring preload spacer.

Being that my buddy with the kit that never took it offroad once, I believe the main issue here is the new operating angle at ride height.

Likely a “long term” thing that Zone didn’t account for. They were one of the first to market with their kit, so my guess is they didn’t do much R&D beyond cycling the suspension to check the components dont bind at the new max angle , and calling it good. Also probably doesn’t happen to that many people so they would’ve needed a larger sample size of Broncos to see this issue.

seems unlikely this is an install issue as if it were, the issue would be popping up on other combo kits like Icon’s, too. Not the only spacer combo kit that offers an inch more than everyone else, ya know?

To me it seems far more likely this is an obvious install issue. There’s probably a lot more people than you think running this kit with absolutely no issue compared to a very few failures.
I’ve personally had this lift and 37’s on my bronco for about 8k miles now. Regular driving and off-roading with no issues whatsoever So I just don’t see how it could be the lift. But I guess time will tell. If it is the kit, you would think they’d start failing a lot more frequently.

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[Dubsesd]

To me it seems far more likely this is an obvious install issue. There’s probably a lot more people than you think running this kit with absolutely no issue compared to a very few failures.
I’ve personally had this lift and 37’s on my bronco for about 8k miles now. Regular driving and off-roading with no issues whatsoever So I just don’t see how it could be the lift. But I guess time will tell. If it is the kit, you would think they’d start failing a lot more frequently.

Do you have a driveline vibration under throttle when in 4A? Mine does and trying to pinpoint the issue. Some people say it’s normal but I’m not sure.

 

[Ducati1098]

Do you have a driveline vibration under throttle when in 4A? Mine does and trying to pinpoint the issue. Some people say it’s normal but I’m not sure.

I do, but I’m pretty sure it’s always been there and can’t say for sure that it has anything to do with the lift. If it does, it still hasn’t broken anything yet though. I haven’t bothered looking into it because I’m never in 4A.

 

[Dubsesd]

I do, but I’m pretty sure it’s always been there and can’t say for sure that it has anything to do with the lift. If it does, it still hasn’t broken anything yet though. I haven’t bothered looking into it because I’m never in 4A.

Thanks. I’ll be driving another un molested Sasquatch soon and I’ll report back.

 

[Derbystud]

The problem is that Ford spends millions on research and development to make sure everything works right together. Aftermarket companies are out to make as much money as they can so they spend little to none. Its very rare that things Aftermarket work as good as factory developed.

 

[‘21OBX]

This is a concern but also the reason I had my dealer do the lift. They claim they will stand behind it. And the lift I went with has a diff drop and track bar relocate to help. I’ll report back in a few weeks as we are heading to the UP for our first outing since the 37” tires are on. Hoping not to destroy too much.

 

[RainbowStix]

To me it seems far more likely this is an obvious install issue. There’s probably a lot more people than you think running this kit with absolutely no issue compared to a very few failures.
I’ve personally had this lift and 37’s on my bronco for about 8k miles now. Regular driving and off-roading with no issues whatsoever So I just don’t see how it could be the lift. But I guess time will tell. If it is the kit, you would think they’d start failing a lot more frequently.

That’s exactly what I mean.. long term issues that don’t affect many people. So it’s possible zone missed this in their R&D.

it’s not like this is the only kit out that utilizes spring and top hat spacers. However, since people only seem to be having with this specific kit from this specific brand (and not icon, readylift, etc), you have to ask yourself what’s different…

Like I said, I don’t have the kit to make a full comparison but from what I could find online about this spring+top hat spacer kit and others, it’s the promised lift height being an inch more than the next guy.

If it was an install issue, why aren’t others posting the same thing happening on other kits that basically have the same elements and same install instructions?

Do you have a driveline vibration under throttle when in 4A? Mine does and trying to pinpoint the issue. Some people say it’s normal but I’m not sure.

Not normal for me

 

[Ducati1098]

That’s exactly what I mean.. long term issues that don’t affect many people.

it’s not like this is the only kit out that utilizes spring and top hat spacers. However, since people only seem to be having with this specific kit from this specific brand (and not icon, readylift, etc), you have to ask yourself what’s different…

Like I said, I don’t have the kit to make a full comparison but from what I could find online about this spring+top hat spacer kit and others, it’s the promised lift height being an inch more than the next guy.

If it was an install issue, why aren’t others posting the same thing happening on other kits that basically have the same elements and same install instructions?

I guess what I’m getting at is the only difference is who installs the kit. The kit never changes. It’s identical on every bronco.

So if it works on most Broncos for multiple thousands of miles… what difference is left? Incorrect installation is all I can think of.

 

[‘21OBX]

That’s exactly what I mean.. long term issues that don’t affect many people. So it’s possible zone missed this in their R&D.

it’s not like this is the only kit out that utilizes spring and top hat spacers. However, since people only seem to be having with this specific kit from this specific brand (and not icon, readylift, etc), you have to ask yourself what’s different…

Like I said, I don’t have the kit to make a full comparison but from what I could find online about this spring+top hat spacer kit and others, it’s the promised lift height being an inch more than the next guy.

If it was an install issue, why aren’t others posting the same thing happening on other kits that basically have the same elements and same install instructions?



Not normal for me

Not normal for me either.

 

[RainbowStix]

I guess what I’m getting at is the only difference is who installs the kit. The kit never changes. It’s identical on every bronco.

So if it works on most Broncos for multiple thousands of miles… what difference is left? Incorrect installation is all I can think of.

The problem with that thinking is the assumption that every bronco and kit is actually the same. Between Ford’s QC and an aftermarket company’s, seems impossible. But that’s another conversation.

just because one part works for 1000 guys, doesn’t guarantee it’ll work for the one right after and vice versa. Especially with cars.

If it was bad installers, wouldn’t you think that those installers would be installing other kits that have the same install method and getting them wrong too? So we’d be seeing posts from people using other kits? Zone does not have special installation instructions vs similar kits.

you could be right in that it’s an install issue. Just doesn’t seem likely since there’s other kits out that have the same install parts and procedure as the zone, but for some reason, all of the incidents I’ve seen were running the zone kit. Coincidence is always possible though!

fyi, the only lift I’ve seen over 3” (2” from SAS height) requires you to drop the front crossmember, ya know other than Zone

 

[Ducati1098]

The problem with that thinking is the assumption that every bronco and kit is actually the same. Between Ford’s QC and an aftermarket company’s, literally impossible. But that’s another conversation.

just because one part works for one guy, doesn’t mean it’ll work for the 1000 others after and vice versa.

wouldn’t you think that those installers would be installing other kits that have the same install method and getting them wrong too? So we’d be seeing posts from people using other kits?

Sorry, I completely disagree. If one part works for someone, it should work the exact same on another bronco that is the exact same. The design of the lift hasn’t changed. My kit has the same cv angles as the next one.

The only time that wouldn’t be true would be quality control like you said, however there are no broken parts other than the factory axle. There hasn’t been a single broken lift kit component that has gone bad as far as I know.

So what is different between the zone kit installed on my bronco that has no problems, and the zone kit installed on on one that you’ve seen fail?

 

[Ducati1098]

If it was bad installers, wouldn’t you think that those installers would be installing other kits that have the same install method and getting them wrong too? So we’d be seeing posts from people using other kits? Zone does not have special installation instructions vs similar kits.

I don’t have another kit installed, or know the installers of those lifts. So that’s speculation as far as I’m concerned.

All I know is the only difference between mine and one that you’re claiming has supposedly broken because of this lift, is the person that’s installed it. I think we can both agree on that.

 

[RainbowStix]

If one part works for someone, it should work the exact same on another bronco that is the exact same.

Yeah… welcome to the real world / automotive industry I guess… I don’t want to explain tolerances.

what I will leave you with is a story… when I first installed the broncbushing, I noticed my steering wheel get a lot tighter and lost recentering on it. But why? Its been installed on 100 other broncos before mine. Following your logic, it should’ve worked the exact same, right? Well I called up BroncBuster, told em my issue which he responded “oh yeah your steering rack is a little out of spec, we’ve seen it on <5% of broncos. No worries, I’ll send you the updated part that’s 3/1000in smaller” not an interaction you’ll get 9/10 times, especially from bigger aftermarket companies.

or let’s go to the idea of the 2.7 recall and recalls in general…

If they’re all made the same and it wasn’t an installer issue, why recall 25K vehicles with potentially bad engines if only <1% of them will blow?

So what is different between the zone kit installed on my bronco that has no problems, and the zone kit installed on on one that you’ve seen fail?

building off my main point, that’s the thing about long-term issues that dont affect many people…

the main reasons I’m not seeing It being an install issue are
1) the zone kit install is not specialized and is the same as every similar kit. So, I would think cv axle issues would be popping up on other similar kits if the install was bad.
2) the known cv axle incidents are only coming from the zone kit

 

[Ducati1098]

Yeah… welcome to the real world / automotive industry I guess… I don’t want to explain tolerances.

what I will leave you with is a story… when I first installed the broncbushing, I noticed my steering wheel get a lot tighter and lost recentering on it. But why? Its been installed on 100 other broncos before mine. Following your logic, it should’ve worked the exact same, right? Well I called up BroncBuster, told em my issue which he responded with “oh yeah your steering rack is a little out of spec, we’ve seen it on <5% of broncos. No worries, I’ll send you the updated part that’s 3/1000in smaller” not an interaction you’ll get 9/10 times, especially from bigger aftermarket companies
building off my main point, that’s the thing about long-term issues that doesn’t affect everyone…

You keep bringing up other instances to try and cement your point, but you still don’t answer my question. Some tiny 5% difference might matter on some things, but you can’t claim tolerances for everything without any proof. What is the difference between mine and one of these that has supposedly broken because of this lift?

As far as “real world / automotive industry” I’m quite familiar with it. Ive been with Ford quite a while now.
Also since you mentioned it… ICON has a 3” spacer type kit for SAS with no type of drop or anything. They don’t seem to have issues with. But either way at this point I’ll just agree to disagree with you. I understand what you’re saying, I just think you’re trying to blame the lift for something it didn’t create.

 

[RainbowStix]

You keep bringing up other instances to try and cement your point, but you still don’t answer my question. Some tiny 5% difference might matter on some things, but you can’t claim tolerances for everything without any proof. What is the difference is between mine and one of these that has supposedly broken because of this lift?

As far as “real world / automotive industry” I’m quite familiar with it. Ive been with Ford quite a while now.
Also since you mentioned it… ICON has a 3” spacer only kit for SAS with no type of drop or anything. They don’t seem to have issues with that, even though you could arguably say that’s a worse way of lifting then the way zone does it. but either way at this point I’ll just agree to disagree with you. I understand what you’re saying, I just think you’re trying to blame the lift for something it didn’t create.

Yeah man, I don’t have to prove anything. Like your’s, it’s just a theory some just happen to hold more water than others.

can you prove it was a bad install? Who cares it’s just a theory

Since you’ve been with Ford for quite a while, you should ask them what the difference is between the 2.7s that didn’t fail but was included in the recall and the ones that did. HINT: there isn’t one.

Good you bring up the Icon kit because I’m mildly familiar with it (I run it on mine). I believe that quoted 3” is from non-SAS height which is ~2” from SAS since you don’t use a set of spacers with the SAS shocks. Anyways, I actually measured the lift and its 2.56” in the front from stock non-SAS, so they lied. It’s a common practice when it comes to lift kits, which I think someone who’s very familiar with the automotive industry would know. I can’t make the same comparison on Zone as I don’t have their kit but I am almost positive it’s higher. They lift the bronco the same way, just with different sizes on their spacers.

i know no one likes the guy that blames the lift since dealerships pull that garbage all the time, but think about it logically. If there are only 4 incidents where someone’s cv blew and it came all from the same kit when there’s about 5 other similar kits out, and the only difference between the kit that failed and the 5 others is the promised lift height, you wouldn’t, for a second think, that could be the cause? Quite a coincidence but we go and blame a boogeyman installer

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