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Raptor R 5.2 V8 engine swap

userdude

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Have yet to see any newer 6g Broncos competing at KOH with a solid front axle swap. And I hope I never do.
I meant that they disabled the systems you were talking about. I remember somebody saying Ford (probably?) helped them do that.
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Aonarch

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No thanks!!! adding a few hp with an oversized-antiquated NA v8 is NOT worth making it ride like shit, steer like a jeep, have NO ABS and traction control, no cruise controll, no trail turn assist, ect... There's NO way that ugly front axle has the correct ABS tone ring, trust me.

What a caveman build with no brains, all Brawn.


the 460hp 5.0 is a better option!

and the 760 hp 5.2 is the best choice!
Agreed.
 

BigMeatsBronco

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I meant that they disabled the systems you were talking about. I remember somebody saying Ford (probably?) helped them do that.
Yeah, all the race trucks have the A. B S disconnected, all the cruise control and goat modes don't work, stability control disconnected. While these things aren't necessary to race, The real reason they're disconnected is because it's too difficult for most builders to keep the electrical stuff connected and have everything work in a modified fashion. They take the easy way out and just omit Or delete the problem area., Instead of creating a solution. This is fine for a dedicated race truck, but not for a daily driver. My Bronco is approaching 80,000 miles.
And I enjoy all of the features that it has. I don't want to remove any of them just for a few ponies.
 

userdude

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Yeah, all the race trucks have the A. B S disconnected, all the cruise control and goat modes don't work, stability control disconnected. While these things aren't necessary to race, The real reason they're disconnected is because it's too difficult for most builders to keep the electrical stuff connected and have everything work in a modified fashion. They take the easy way out and just omit Or delete the problem area., Instead of creating a solution. This is fine for a dedicated race truck, but not for a daily driver. My Bronco is approaching 80,000 miles.
And I enjoy all of the features that it has. I don't want to remove any of them just for a few ponies.
What do you think it would cost to put the engine you want and get it working in your Bronco? (Or another if that's what you want.)
 

22luxobx

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Agree, it’s nice to see them putting and trying the Godzilla platform but would at the least prefer a coyote and obviously the predator is the end goal as the performance is well worth it over the big 7.3
 

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TeocaliMG

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I've put a lot of research in time into this and it's totally doable and all the electrical doohickeys and Wizardry can be figured out pretty easily the biggest hurdle is the initial cost.
The "electrical wizardry" may be figured out pretty easily by the right folks: Either calibrators at Ford with the proprietary keys and kit, or some silly valley folks who all of a sudden are more interested in motor swaps than working at the latest tech start up.

I don't disagree that the upfront cost of the motor is a big deal, (especially for the 5.2), but if I was 100% certain I could get the electronics figured out mostly on my own I would have a replacement engine on order now.

I am too busy and unconfident to pull the trigger right now, I know the OEM will never support calibrations for this purpose either. My source of hopium is that the demand for engine swaps across all semi-modern vehicles will grow so much in the next decade that it will create the market for some of those silley valley nerds mentioned to develop a module that can bust any CAN system and make it do whatever you want with whatever is spliced in. If I thought I could do that, I would quit my job today and start that company but alas I am a mechanical engineer.


Are there any software/CS/programmers on the forum who have any interest in this at all? I want a module that can plug in between a vehicle and non-oe engine and match pinouts (easyish) and convert or spoof signals/signal names (hardish)
 

BigMeatsBronco

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The "electrical wizardry" may be figured out pretty easily by the right folks: Either calibrators at Ford with the proprietary keys and kit, or some silly valley folks who all of a sudden are more interested in motor swaps than working at the latest tech start up.

I don't disagree that the upfront cost of the motor is a big deal, (especially for the 5.2), but if I was 100% certain I could get the electronics figured out mostly on my own I would have a replacement engine on order now.

I am too busy and unconfident to pull the trigger right now, I know the OEM will never support calibrations for this purpose either. My source of hopium is that the demand for engine swaps across all semi-modern vehicles will grow so much in the next decade that it will create the market for some of those silley valley nerds mentioned to develop a module that can bust any CAN system and make it do whatever you want with whatever is spliced in. If I thought I could do that, I would quit my job today and start that company but alas I am a mechanical engineer.


Are there any software/CS/programmers on the forum who have any interest in this at all? I want a module that can plug in between a vehicle and non-oe engine and match pinouts (easyish) and convert or spoof signals/signal names (hardish)
I don't believe it's nearly that difficult. I've already proved you can the program modules across different platforms, This opens the doors for much more. There is a risk of bricking modules and the cost of replacement is not cheap. I already have a massive wiring printout of both donor vehicle and the 5.2 pcm. All the wiring is identical except a few easy to add ones. the ecms use the same canbus communication and strategies. Bosche (not Ford) creates the programming to actually be as universal as possible...so the same or similar modules can be used on a multitude of applications. Although I do believe it is totally possible to reprogram all the broncos modules to accept the 5.2s architecture and work seamlessly, a less time consuming solution is on my mind and I plan on swapping in a 5.2 later this year. once the project is underway I'll update and do a build thread.
 

BigMeatsBronco

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What do you think it would cost to put the engine you want and get it working in your Bronco? (Or another if that's what you want.)
The engine is $30,000 by itself...then you need to upgrade the transmission as well...Then address the fuel system as priority. Many if not all the Bronco’s modules can be reused with new programming and configuration. I'm guessing somewhere between $50,000 and $60,000 if ALL new OEM parts are used. this cost could be shaved in half with used parts.
 

TeocaliMG

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you can match the modules up easy enough, and the pinouts, but what won't you need the right cals (with right signal names) to run? Not just "right" but potentially totally custom.

To jog my memory, what cross platform modules did you reflash to work?

Cals are easy for the right people with the right tools, but quite difficult for most of us.
 

userdude

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I don't believe it's nearly that difficult. I've already proved you can the program modules across different platforms, This opens the doors for much more. There is a risk of bricking modules and the cost of replacement is not cheap. I already have a massive wiring printout of both donor vehicle and the 5.2 pcm. All the wiring is identical except a few easy to add ones. the ecms use the same canbus communication and strategies. Bosche (not Ford) creates the programming to actually be as universal as possible...so the same or similar modules can be used on a multitude of applications. Although I do believe it is totally possible to reprogram all the broncos modules to accept the 5.2s architecture and work seamlessly, a less time consuming solution is on my mind and I plan on swapping in a 5.2 later this year. once the project is underway I'll update and do a build thread.
Can't wait to see that! 🤩
 
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mpeugeot

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you can match the modules up easy enough, and the pinouts, but what won't you need the right cals (with right signal names) to run? Not just "right" but potentially totally custom.

To jog my memory, what cross platform modules did you reflash to work?

Cals are easy for the right people with the right tools, but quite difficult for most of us.
HOSS 3.0 steering rack.
 

TeocaliMG

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HOSS 3.0 steering rack.
I wasnt sure if he had done another, the hoss 3.0 rack tentatively qualifies in this regard. and I dont mean to take away from that achievement, It was impressive to get it working so early in a different model Bronco without any Ford support, but it is afterall basically identical mechatronics across all the steering racks. A PCM even with the same harness design (2 pot vs 3 pot) I imagine is much harder to get "happy" but man I hope I'm wrong! I have some pinouts myself, but I know that alone is not enough, even if I match signals/pins as best I can, the actual signal names are wrong hence I think I need a translator, or unique calibration. (again, I hope i'm wrong)
 

CarmeloS

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I wouldn't care if I found a junkyard Coyote from a F150 with less miles than my Bronco (as long as the engines solid) and a custom adaptor to a Tremec to make it work, I just want a V8 and manual. I still wanna gut some unnecessary airbags, remove Eco mode and disable a few sensors as long as its still functional and badass.

I mean, he made this build work with a $1200 Explorer engine, why not do something similar?
 

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I wasnt sure if he had done another, the hoss 3.0 rack tentatively qualifies in this regard. and I dont mean to take away from that achievement, It was impressive to get it working so early in a different model Bronco without any Ford support, but it is afterall basically identical mechatronics across all the steering racks. A PCM even with the same harness design (2 pot vs 3 pot) I imagine is much harder to get "happy" but man I hope I'm wrong! I have some pinouts myself, but I know that alone is not enough, even if I match signals/pins as best I can, the actual signal names are wrong hence I think I need a translator, or unique calibration. (again, I hope i'm wrong)
I actually don't think that it will be all that much harder if it's largely pin compatible. If I had unlimited time and resources, I would try some pretty creative approaches. I have theories, but it would be so much easier if I could peek inside the black box for a day.
 

BigMeatsBronco

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you can match the modules up easy enough, and the pinouts, but what won't you need the right cals (with right signal names) to run? Not just "right" but potentially totally custom.

To jog my memory, what cross platform modules did you reflash to work?

Cals are easy for the right people with the right tools, but quite difficult for most of us.
I belong to a forum called diog.net.. Well I don't contribute much there. It is a read-only forum for me. And I have learned a great deal about this subject. I've read about and watched literally hundreds of mechanics in the nation. Use modules that are used or new and install them in. Many different makes and models across platforms in places. They don't belong or did not originate. The vehicle architecture, it's quite simple and ninety nine percent of the modules have the same pin outs for the same vehicles purposes. The computers communicate together the same way. T This is really not that difficult to do, and there are several ways to solve the problems that may arise.

Plan a would be to simply program the Broncos modules To think they are in a different the vehicle.

When b would be to rob the actual modules from the other vehicle and install them in the bronco. This is a very good prospect, as ninety nine percent of the wiring harness is the same across platforms
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