I’m not sure on that. I just used teflon on the drain plugs and they’ve since been fine.
well said. This is a costly and time consuming battle that is hard to win. Just need to deal with the compromises. There is no such thing as a perfect solution without compromise. Portals are no exception.
Originally I had the brake and leaking issues removed as I was focusing on the portals themselves and how they performed as a bolt on accessory, but it’s a “74weld portal review” not just portals. So it needed to be included as pertinent information.
Reminds me of lift blocks vs leaf springs when I first started wheeling.
Here you go. Third one was on a Toyota also on the bottom. Not sure if I’d say the steering stop is a “failure” as you can still drive, but it did break off.
. “The bumper to bumper warranty only covers things we make, so…that’s actually a pretty small list. That’ll be $2084 please”
Sounds like you need the solution that Loren just did on the new Fun Haver LT, with a hydro steering rack pretty slick although ATM you loose GOAT modes. At this point though its like a 200k type build and not soo much DD/bolt on.
Definitely! Oh the wheel hop
thanks for the quick reply @SierraBronco great photos and detailed info. I seem to remember 74Weld doing a video of a failure like this that they brought parts in and repaired on the trail. The Foutz ends are just like the RPG. I’ll have to look into the Rock Krawler ones. I worked on cargo and commercial aircraft for years and they used that same concept of a “sacrificial” shear pin/bolt in numerous locations. MUCH easier to install a replacement bolt on the trail. After seeing these types of failures on machined parts I can’t help but wonder if stress risers caused by the machine might have contributed to the failure and if so would shot peening have made a difference? And how much would shot peening add to the cost.Here you go. Third one was on a Toyota also on the bottom. Not sure if I’d say the steering stop is a “failure” as you can still drive, but it did break off.
I’m not sure where the Foutz tierod weak point is (or if there is one) but if they’re like the double shear RPG tierods we have where they’re built ridiculously strong, you might consider something else. I’m pulling ours in favor of Rock Krawler as they designed the yoke bolt to be the failure point. As @ScLeCo found out, the RPG tierods break the rack itself inside the billet housing. 74w will not cover that under their warranty as the broken rack is made by Ford, despite shipping the entire rack as a complete assembly. (Imagine if Ford refused to honor their warranty because they don’t make the part themselves
Pros and cons are very well stated. I agree with everything you are saying.... That is the whole history of 4x4ing.... make something better and you just made something else worse.... It is all about finding the best balance that works for you... FUNNY, I do not think I have met anyone satisfied with their entire set up yet.... No matter what the level, there is always something to improve on and it usually raised its head on a recent outing...LOL...
Best write ever! Thank you for sharing your experience and providing an interesting story as well.Update-Obviously clearance is huge. Definitely beneficial in situations like rock gardens where all the extra clearance makes one more carefree on the lines they can take. It makes sense why they are so popular for racing as one can go smash mode (assuming the portals hold up.) Probably why there’s such a big difference between race and consumer portals-race can go smashey. Racers also don’t worry about needing to retain the electric steering rack so they can actually drive down the road. Or have cruise control. Or if the lockers/4WD will work if there’s a tone ring failure.
CV and tierod angles compared to lift achieved is also hugely beneficial.
Gear reduction is also nice. Really liked how the 1.35:1 werewolves felt on the two door the little bit I drove it.
As far as their use on full bodied rigs where we want to daily the rig and use it for actual wheeling, after hitting the trails with several portal broncos and normal broncos, I’m not sold. They are marketed as being the ultimate bolt on solution, but that is misleading. First, big jump in COG. You’re going to be very tippy, especially on stock suspension without any flex. You can lower things with aftermarket coilovers, but now you’re going to bottom out like crazy. New coilovers or not you’ll want to make changes to your shocks to account for all the new unsprung mass. Back to stability-the additional width from the portals does help if your tire size stays the same, but now your scrub radius goes up drastically and mass/leverage goes through the roof, so you need to strengthen your steering components. Aftermarket wheels might help with scrub radius, but now you’re back to tippiness and again-you’ll want to lower it. Now we’re looking at taller shock towers to optimize where the coilover rides to avoid bottoming out. Shit is adding up for the ultimate bolt on solution. The additional leverage will absolutely put more stress on your suspension components and mounting points. So those need strengthened too.
Also it seemed like the portal rigs did start bouncing sooner than the conventional rigs. Perhaps the additional leverage is the culprit when the circumstances are just right. Heim UCA was slightly better but all the portal rigs were more prone to bouncing.
Additional complexity could be of concern. Spare parts aren’t readily available from your local auto parts store. 74w rear portals uses custom rotors you can’t buy from anyone but 74w. Same could be said for long travel components but they aren’t gears spinning constantly whenever the vehicle is moving. If you shell a gear are you prepared to pull the box apart and remove what’s necessary to get out? Carrying gear oil? And of course now there is additional maintenance that is needed, and four more potential areas to leak or be damaged by water.
With all things considered, dollar for dollar compared to long travel I’m thinking long travel is more appropriate. 74w likes to talk about how strong their portals are, and there was no reason to doubt them (brake bracket failures not being included in the structure) up until recently where four boxes had structural failures on two different broncos and two other Toyotas. At this point, you’re stuck as there is no welding the box together to get out. You’re now waiting on parts from 74w to get your car off the trail. If you aren’t an influencer they don’t seem quite as interested in getting you parts quickly or honoring the warranty. Toyota homie has been waiting a couple weeks only for them to blame the factory Toyota Land Cruiser tierods causing the break, and it will be $1700 per box to replace. For some reason he’s under the impression he needs to buy both sides. I guess something changed so if he only buys one they’ll then be different. Not sure what’s going on there. But either way I believe he’s had them less than 7 months.
Original review with initial impressions-
Just got back from Moab and time to give an honest assessment on this somewhat controversial/debated upgrade. People have a tendency to abstain from saying anything bad after spending such a crazy amount of money on an accessory, but that’s not me and I owe nothing to 74Weld. No notes were taken real time so this will mostly be a rambling of words as they’re thought of. I’ll try to keep the different topics separated.
Important update-read this first
https://www.bronco6g.com/forum/threads/74weld-portal-review.100508/post-2375377
Drove on the interstate at mostly 85ish mph and of course there is no gear noise despite what @tmason10 tries to claim about straight cut gears in portals. We have zero CEL’s and adaptive cruise/lane assist still work without issue. Checked temps on the first fuel up after about two hours of driving. Rear portals at 160F rear diff at 192F. Front portals 91F front diff (32 spline spicer) 212F. All running new Maxima full synthetic oil. 75W140 in differentials as recommended by Dana. 75W90 in portals to 74Weld spec. Fuel economy on 40” Toyo Open Country MT at 30 psi 12.2 mpg. Increased to 14 mpg for the rest of the trip. Cruising RPM might be 2400 with the ten speed auto.
On the trail you will absolutely crawl in 4L M1. It’s fantastic. The clearance is ridiculous as anyone would expect. All the benefits that anyone has ever mentioned are very real so we’ll focus on…maybe not “negatives”…but things we learned. The first big thing we probably all realize is the vast increase in scrub radius. Pushing that 110 pound 40” tire at seven psi plus wheel plus beadlocks plus portal out 3.5” away from the pivot points is a lot for the steering rack to move. It wasn’t unexpected that there would be times the rack wouldn’t be able to keep up, but it did happen more often than we would’ve liked. Definitely need to plan the lines out where the steering can be done while moving as often as possible. Continuing the scrub radius discussion, the toe-in under droop is further exaggerated by the extension of the portals. This is made even worse with a yoke for heims rather than the Ford ball joints.
I’ll include a pixelated close up from Hells Gate where passenger tire is straight but driver is toed in under full droop. I thought maybe we knocked the alignment way off on high dive and I just hadn’t noticed it, but after she got to the top I measured it out and it’s fine. Another interesting observation is that this combination of IFS and huge scrub radius made it very important to be smooth with throttle control and braking modulation. Sudden lifting of the front from throttle or diving under braking can cause a deviation from the planned line whereas under the same scenarios it wasn’t an issue on rigs equipped with a long travel suspension. Mrs. Sierra Bronco has a newfound ambition to become proficient with two footed driving and pushing through the brakes. Will also do more experimenting with the one pedal driving option to see if that is better than what humans can accomplish. We’re definitely happy that our Wildtrak has rock crawl mode to help with throttle response, but driving skills will be improved on as well.
Also when planning lines it’s important to note the additional clearance will make the rig behave differently compared to similar builds without portals. We reached out to a local that is also a guide and Bronco Offroadeo instructor as we hadn’t done Cliffhanger or Pritchett before and wanted an experienced person with us. This wasn’t his first Bronco on 40’s, but it was the first one with portals. On the way down from Cliffhanger there’s an optional obstacle where you pivot your rockslider off of a rock to straighten up with the drop. Ours started to pivot, then popped up over the rock and hoo lawdy was it close to rolling. He was beating himself up on what happened when we pointed out we’re likely 4” higher on the frame compared to the other rigs, with UHMW skids, and our body mounted sliders are 1.5” higher due to the body lift. Then it all made sense. Lesson learned.
Reliability wasn’t an issue. The Bronco took some massive hits on the front end but luckily all the LCA mounts had been strengthened and we also welded on double shear UCA mounts. The front passenger corner basically took the full 6100 pounds from a five foot drop (slide) with the tire turned and while metals were likely fatigued, nothing bent or broke. Not sure if the one ton bearing packs and lugs would’ve made a difference over what the other portal options come with, but it was certainly nice knowing they were beefy as hell. Don’t forget the steering knuckles. Or 1” shafts from the RK coilovers.
In summary, we found a lot of things we can improve on with our driving and spotting now that we have an idea of how the portals affect vehicle behaviors when wheeling. The effects of scrub radius increase makes sense when you think about it after the fact, we just didn’t anticipate it at the time.
When they were brought up as a solution for the increased unsprung mass (definitely something that needs to be addressed. Once again-not simply a bolt on solution) I didn’t see any reason to drop $8k on those. Sure they’re top of the line Fox but I can get 1” 17-4 Hardened Stainless Shafts with a 2.625” body and custom shim tuning from Rock Krawler. On the portal car external reservoirs aren’t really necessary, but they help gain a little more travel within the constraints of the factory mounting, so now you have a ton of extra fluid if that’s something you’re worried about with the body size difference. And then of course-phenomenal customer service from Rock Krawler. So-went with RK. That brings us to the next topic:
