Moab Off-Roadeo Tempered My Enthusiasm

[Tricky Dick]

I've had my 2 Door BD for just over a year now. It's lifted 1.5" (Bilstein 5100s) and has 33s on it. Still haven't done any serious rock crawling in it yet, but it's been more than acceptable for all the back country exploring/camping we have done. Overall the belly clearance hasn't been an issue, with only a few moderate hits. The one time I definitely wanted more clearance was when attempting a muddy wash crossing. I was dragging too much underneath the claw through the goo (super wet bentonite clay). Ended up backing out and taking another route. Mud tires may have made the difference versus the Falken AT3Ws.

Overall I'm really happy with it. I love the nimbleness of the 2 door, the 2.3L has all the power I want, and it's really fun to drive both on and off road. However, I've come to realize that a removable top and doors really isn't that important to me, as most of our adventuring is miles upon miles of back country exploring on dusty roads. Knowing what I know now, if I owned a 4Runner ORP, I wouldn't make the switch.

It's funny, a couple months ago I expressed some similar sentiments to your original post and was similarly roasted. The Bronco certainly isn't a bad offroader, but in the tough stuff a clapped XJ on 33s is going to show up a Sasquatch so tempered expectations are good.

Are you going to the Bronco Safari next year? I have a thread going to drum up interest.

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[Hemisfear]

After spending a day (10/1) behind the wheel of a 4 door Badlands (2.7L, non-SAS), my enthusiasm for the Bronco 6G has diminished. Between that and having no clue if or when my Bronco will be delivered, I keep having nagging moments where I wonder if it's worth waiting for--I could go buy a new JL off a lot tomorrow.

Before I get into the whys, here are some positive thoughts. The Moab Off-Road crew were outstanding and provided us with a very enjoyable day--thanks Brian! I highly recommend it to everyone, whether you are a first timer (like the guy in the Bronco ahead of us) or very experienced off-roader like me (been wheeling around Moab for 30+ years). Overall the Bronco was really nice, the 4 door drives and wheels much smaller than expected, and is very capable off road.

My point of reference comes from wheeling various Toyota 4Runners and Pickups (all of them torsion bar IFS) and, for the last 20+ years, my dependable 1998 Jeep Cherokee (XJ). My XJ has 4.5" lift, 33x10.50R15 tires, open diffs, swaybar disconnects and a few other mods. The Dome Plateau trail the Off-Roadeo drives represents the middle of the spectrum of trails/roads we routinely drive. Now, here's what gives me pause.

Whereas the ride and steering on the highway was smooth and tight, there was a surprising amount of body roll. Noticeably more than I experience in my XJ. In addition, the off road ride was not significantly better than that of my XJ, with the exception of "high" speed rough road travel (as expected)--Sand Mode on the two track smoother stretches was a blast. The Bronco confirmed my experience that a properly built solid front axle 4x4 can handle and ride almost equally as well, both on and off-road.

The ground clearance is not enough, especially for a 4 door, non-SAS, 2.7L. We were wheeling the only non-SAS Bronco, but even the SAS-equipped Broncos occasionally hit the undercarriage and skid plates. Heading back to headquarters, we kept hitting those F'N STUPID (2.7L) braces between the frame and the transmission cross member (they hang down a good inch or more from any of the skid plates). No matter how carefully I picked a line, I kept kissing or hitting rocks in surprising spots on the road--to the point that it pissed me off. SAS definitely helps, but even it isn't enough for wheeling on serious rocks. The 2 door will be much better, especially the 2.3L (no FREAKIN cross member brace) with SAS.

Most importantly, both me and my son, commented to each other several times throughout the day that we felt like we were driving a Jeep.

I've ordered a 2 door 2.3L auto Black Diamond (supposedly built on 7/16) and the plan has been to lift it a couple inches, shodding it with 33s. I'm not sure that will be enough. However, all this said, I'll probably still go through with the purchase (assuming Ford hasn't lost it) and see if it will be able to keep up with the Cherokees. I hope it will, because the Bronco 6G has a lot that I really like.

Nice try...

 

[MoabRox]

It's funny, a couple months ago I expressed some similar sentiments to your original post and was similarly roasted. The Bronco certainly isn't a bad offroader, but in the tough stuff a clapped XJ on 33s is going to show up a Sasquatch so tempered expectations are good.

Are you going to the Bronco Safari next year? I have a thread going to drum up interest.

I remember that post and the responses. It's an XJ thing, apparently, and some will never get it.

The Bronco Safari sounds like fun. I'll find your tread and respond there.

 

[MoabRox]

Nice try...

Try at what? Just expressing my sincere opinion.

 

[ATLBronco75]

I honestly don't think the Bronco is for people that already drive highly modified off-road vehicles. I watch enough Matt's off road recovery to know that a modern vehicle with the luxuries I enjoy will never match a modded XJ. However, it's a damn sight better for driving hours at a time with a fun offroad jaunt at the end.

 

[dgorsett]

I started rereading this thread before checking the date..how prophetic @MoabRox, @goatman, @Theherofails and maybe even me turned out to be. The Bronco is an amazing vehicle and fun beyond belief but issues with keeping four wheels planted and belly clearance are the weak spots. Any mods should concentrate on these issues. We with XJ and Bronco II experience will strive to match the perceived perfection of those great rigs.

 

[Theherofails]

I started rereading this thread before checking the date..how prophetic @MoabRox, @goatman, @Theherofails and maybe even me turned out to be. The Bronco is an amazing vehicle and fun beyond belief but issues with keeping four wheels planted and belly clearance are the weak spots. Any mods should concentrate on these issues. We with XJ and Bronco II experience will strive to match the perceived perfection of those great rigs.

I've done quite a lot of mods now and have put thousands of miles on the Bronco off-road. It's a great vehicle but even with Sasquatch, it really does have the shortcomings we discussed last year.

Now that I'm on 37s with a good lift (Icon Stage 4 w/adjustable coil overs), I think I'm finally equal to an XJ on 33s. I still get annoyed when I have to work a line carefully just to have a Rubicon on 35/37s walk down the same obstacle with ease. You just can't overcome the lack of flex at times. My biggest problem have been the skids for the rear lower trailing arms. They end up flat faced to rocks constantly and will stop you dead in your tracks when trying to clear large (3' or taller) vertical ledges. Been looking for a weld on option that adds a more gentle slope to get my rear over ledges easier.

I snapped a tie rod on this very ledge due to the problem with the factory skids on the lower trailing arm mounts. It'll catch and never let go, and if your front lockers are engaged.. RIP.



With that said, I LOVE the Bronco and it does amazing - even on 8+ rated trails. You just gotta work within its boundaries. I wouldn't trade it for any other off-road vehicle, because none that I have driven are just quite this fun. Sure, you may have to work a line a little harder, but the pay off is just that much better when you're at the finish line.

 

[ATLBronco75]

I've done quite a lot of mods now and have put thousands of miles on the Bronco off-road. It's a great vehicle but even with Sasquatch, it really does have the shortcomings we discussed last year.

Now that I'm on 37s with a good lift (Icon Stage 4 w/adjustable coil overs), I think I'm finally equal to an XJ on 33s. I still get annoyed when I have to work a line carefully just to have a Rubicon on 35/37s walk down the same obstacle with ease. You just can't overcome the lack of flex at times. My biggest problem have been the skids for the rear lower trailing arms. They end up flat faced to rocks constantly and will stop you dead in your tracks when trying to clear large (3' or taller) vertical ledges. Been looking for a weld on option that adds a more gentle slope to get my rear over ledges easier.

I snapped a tie rod on this very ledge due to the problem with the factory skids on the lower trailing arm mounts. It'll catch and never let go, and if your front lockers are engaged.. RIP.



With that said, I LOVE the Bronco and it does amazing - even on 8+ rated trails. You just gotta work within its boundaries. I wouldn't trade it for any other off-road vehicle, because none that I have driven are just quite this fun. Sure, you may have to work a line a little harder, but the pay off is just that much better when you're at the finish line.

Any front end shots of those bumper lights? I'm interested in the same install.

 

[Theherofails]

Any front end shots of those bumper lights? I'm interested in the same install.

I ended up moving them in a bit for esthetic reasons so they’re now centered under the B and O. Absolutely LOVE the front bumper lights. These are a 9” model and put out about 15k lumens each. My light bar is GPS enabled and goes from a wide angle to spot depending on speed, so having dedicated spots is nice.

 

[swooshdave]

I've had my 2 Door BD for just over a year now. It's lifted 1.5" (Bilstein 5100s) and has 33s on it. Still haven't done any serious rock crawling in it yet, but it's been more than acceptable for all the back country exploring/camping we have done. Overall the belly clearance hasn't been an issue, with only a few moderate hits. The one time I definitely wanted more clearance was when attempting a muddy wash crossing. I was dragging too much underneath the claw through the goo (super wet bentonite clay). Ended up backing out and taking another route. Mud tires may have made the difference versus the Falken AT3Ws.

Overall I'm really happy with it. I love the nimbleness of the 2 door, the 2.3L has all the power I want, and it's really fun to drive both on and off road. However, I've come to realize that a removable top and doors really isn't that important to me, as most of our adventuring is miles upon miles of back country exploring on dusty roads. Knowing what I know now, if I owned a 4Runner ORP, I wouldn't make the switch.

Thank you for the followup. In your original post it appeared that your concerns were around the ground clearance on 33s. Although you have the Bilsteins I'm surprised you haven't gone to 35s since they are so easy to fit on the Bronco. I'm more surprised you didn't go with the Badlands or even Sasquatch given your background. Or was the plan all along to continue to mod past the level of a stock Sasquatch?

 

[ATLBronco75]

I ended up moving them in a bit for esthetic reasons so they’re now centered under the B and O. Absolutely LOVE the front bumper lights. These are a 9” model and put out about 15k lumens each. My light bar is GPS enabled and goes from a wide angle to spot depending on speed, so having dedicated spots is nice.

Any close ups of the mounts?

 

[Theherofails]

Any close ups of the mounts?

Not handy, but I can try to grab some today. It did take adding a nutsert per side to the modular bumper in order to get 2 bolts in. There is about a .5" gap between the light and the grill doing it this way so it worked out well. No real overhang past the bumper ,either. I'll try to grab some close ups and post it in a thread (I'll tag you), and a link to the lights. My entire rig is Rigid except these, which are Nilight branded. So far, quite pleased for only being $200ish dollars.

Total install time with wiring was maybe ~1 hour. Uses a relay, so I threw it on switch 1 on the upfitters.

 

[MoabRox]

Thank you for the followup. In your original post it appeared that your concerns were around the ground clearance on 33s. Although you have the Bilsteins I'm surprised you haven't gone to 35s since they are so easy to fit on the Bronco. I'm more surprised you didn't go with the Badlands or even Sasquatch given your background. Or was the plan all along to continue to mod past the level of a stock Sasquatch?

Mostly I was on a self imposed budget, but I also like tinkering with my 4x4s. So, having something already "built" wouldn't be as much fun. My intent never was to build a rock crawler (we have a couple very capable XJs in the family for that), but more to build a backcountry explorer (Overlanding if you want to call it that). For me, a 2 door BD with 33s is a great balance (performance and cost to operate) for both on road and off road. Even then I still may wind up with 35s--just because they'd look so good. If I had a 4 door, 35s would have been mandatory to compensate for the longer wheel base (breakover). Now that I have the suspension/ground clearance taken care of, it's time to add some more accessories. Starting with a tailgate reinforcement brace (probably Hammerbuilt's) and then probably a winch (which would have been very nice to have had in that muddy wash).

 

[swooshdave]

Mostly I was on a self imposed budget, but I also like tinkering with my 4x4s. So, having something already "built" wouldn't be as much fun. My intent never was to build a rock crawler (we have a couple very capable XJs in the family for that), but more to build a backcountry explorer (Overlanding if you want to call it that). For me, a 2 door BD with 33s is a great balance (performance and cost to operate) for both on road and off road. Even then I still may wind up with 35s--just because they'd look so good. If I had a 4 door, 35s would have been mandatory to compensate for the longer wheel base (breakover). Now that I have the suspension/ground clearance taken care of, it's time to add some more accessories. Starting with a tailgate reinforcement brace (probably Hammerbuilt's) and then probably a winch (which would have been very nice to have had in that muddy wash).

More importantly do you think your original thread title is still relevant. Are you still less enthusiastic about your Bronco?

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