ROLL BAR DELETE

[Little Foot]

I am interested in more clearance in the back area, for standing with a pop top camper with access from the inside.

1) Anybody know if the Bronco would fold up in on itself if you deleted the roll bar?

2) For example what if only : the roll bar rear cross bar was deleted?

3) What if the rear cross bar was deleted - and replaced with the mid-cross bar as found in the Raptor?

Any insights would be appreciated!

Ford added in an additional bar on the BRaptor because the structure needed more stability. I suggest you either change your plans or find a way to make it work in the current configuration.

Good luck

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[BigMeatsBronco]

Ford added in an additional bar on the BRaptor because the structure needed more stability. I suggest you either change your plans or find a way to make it work in the current configuration.

Good luck

Maybe, but ford also had trouble with the earlier Raptor f150 frames bending when jumped or heavily loaded over bumps. (Now ford upgraded those)
More likely they added the extra stiffness bar on the Braptor because of previous Frame problems on similarly driven vehicles. And because a more door has more leverage to buckle the Frame with the longer wheelbase.

In a sideways rollover, one could argue my new B-pillar crossbar is actually stronger now when lateral forces are applied. Another example would be sliding sideways into a tree or pole at speed, yup crossbar is stronger in this scenario too.

 

[BigMeatsBronco]

HAHA!! I KNEW Someone out there did it !!

So you didnt just relocate the back cross member forward, you cut the roll bar off from the back of the seats in a 2 door - and then fabbed up a new cross bar behind the seats??

MORE PICS PLEASE!!!
Top-Off pics? Interior from the rear Pics?
Anything!! THANK YOU!!!!

Correct...

 

[Carbon Bronco]

Maybe, but ford also had trouble with the earlier Raptor f150 frames bending when jumped or heavily loaded over bumps. (Now ford upgraded those)
More likely they added the extra stiffness bar on the Braptor because of previous Frame problems on similarly driven vehicles. And because a more door has more leverage to buckle the Frame with the longer wheelbase.

In a sideways rollover, one could argue my new B-pillar crossbar is actually stronger now when lateral forces are applied. Another example would be sliding sideways into a tree or pole at speed, yup crossbar is stronger in this scenario too.

I love what you did with your bronco, but I have to ask what's the RBM of a factory rock slider vs the factory roll bar?

 

[Rick Astley]

Maybe, but ford also had trouble with the earlier Raptor f150 frames bending when jumped or heavily loaded over bumps. (Now ford upgraded those)
More likely they added the extra stiffness bar on the Braptor because of previous Frame problems on similarly driven vehicles. And because a more door has more leverage to buckle the Frame with the longer wheelbase.

In a sideways rollover, one could argue my new B-pillar crossbar is actually stronger now when lateral forces are applied. Another example would be sliding sideways into a tree or pole at speed, yup crossbar is stronger in this scenario too.

Not digging into the validity of cutting into the roll cage (drive fast, take chances!), but I do want to know what your process was for welding mild steel to boron steel.

I'm a hack welder (many angle grinders and cubitron disc's at the ready!), but my curiosity is peaked at how you went about it due to boron's unusual characteristics and increased brittleness when heated.

 

[BigMeatsBronco]

Not digging into the validity of cutting into the roll cage (drive fast, take chances!), but I do want to know what your process was for welding mild steel to boron steel.

I'm a hack welder (many angle grinders and cubitron disc's at the ready!), but my curiosity is peaked at how you went about it due to boron's unusual characteristics and increased brittleness when heated.

I never welded the boron roll bar, only welded the steel from the rock slider I used. Like I said I fabbed up 4130 INSERTS that have the same profile as the factory tubes and slid the inserts INSIDE the tube. They have a nice tight fit... And I doubt the rock sliders are boron. Whatever the rocksliders are made out welded up perfectly with 4130.

The ford factory welded the cage with wire feed if you wanna know, I found a piece of wire 4" long inside the cage tube. So it any no fancy tig, heiloarc or anything special.

This BS reminds me of all the old timers that claim " you can't never ever weld 7075 aluminum, it will break, crack and fail!!!"
Those idiot guys were all proved wrong a few yrs ago when the professor in CA university unveiled his new 7075 tig rod with titanium in it...tests show the welds are now stronger than the parent metal on 7075!!! Hell they even have in spools for mig now!

Bottom line is there's a way to weld boron it if I wanted to, I just chose a different route mostly to keep all the naysayers satisfied.

 

[Bruno]

Correct...

Amazing!! Any issues with the tail gate closing?
So cool you did that - I love that you cut up the truck with the dealer plates still on it - HAHA!!
Looks like a good solid execution. You were able to use the cut ends of the roll bar, and integrate a cross bar with mechanical conncetion.
Please update if you have any tail gate issues, my only concern is the body could flex and make the tail gate sticky.
Really unique truck - great job!! You PROVED IT WORKS!!

 

[Stampede.Offroad]

No way would I risk the structural stability by removing the rollbar.

How often do you roll over? Drive from the cargo area because you're 10' tall? As long as you acknowledge the back seat isn't super safe, chop it off and plug a new one in. It doesn't do anything 99% of the time.

I'd be a lot more concerned about vehicle balance and stability if you're adding weight that moves COG up or back with a camper.

 

[LAB0035]

I am interested in more clearance in the back area, for standing with a pop top camper with access from the inside.

1) Anybody know if the Bronco would fold up in on itself if you deleted the roll bar?

2) For example what if only : the roll bar rear cross bar was deleted?

3) What if the rear cross bar was deleted - and replaced with the mid-cross bar as found in the Raptor?

Any insights would be appreciated!

Loss of all body rigidity. Body would start to flex and tear . total loss of warranty . total loss of resale value. Sell it to someone and go buy an old school bus

 

[AMTRV]

How often do you roll over? Drive from the cargo area because you're 10' tall? As long as you acknowledge the back seat isn't super safe, chop it off and plug a new one in. It doesn't do anything 99% of the time.

I'd be a lot more concerned about vehicle balance and stability if you're adding weight that moves COG up or back with a camper.

Not as much about rolling over as it's about structural problems, as has already been mentioned.
Go ahead and cut it out! See what happens.....report back to the forum.
Just FYI, all convertibles that have ever been produced have extra structural bracing from the factory.

 

[BigMeatsBronco]

Not as much about rolling over as it's about structural problems, as has already been mentioned.
Go ahead and cut it out! See what happens.....report back to the forum.
Just FYI, all convertibles that have ever been produced have extra structural bracing from the factory.

Oh really? You mean the U14 had extra bracing? Please divulge.

 

[BigMeatsBronco]

Amazing!! Any issues with the tail gate closing?
So cool you did that - I love that you cut up the truck with the dealer plates still on it - HAHA!!
Looks like a good solid execution. You were able to use the cut ends of the roll bar, and integrate a cross bar with mechanical conncetion.
Please update if you have any tail gate issues, my only concern is the body could flex and make the tail gate sticky.
Really unique truck - great job!! You PROVED IT WORKS!!

The rear gate works just like the wife's factory Badlands... it don't rattle. The roll bar is cut at body height and IS still and integral part of the rear. And keeps the brace to the hindge...Actually I consider it far stiffer on the bed corners than my previous Ranger. Most Pickups have no such support. I'll eventually build a tailgate that folds down.

What's funny is 99%of the worry warts have not looked under the OEM plastic panels to see how the vehicle is made.

 

[bstottlemyer85]

I'm all for this, if someone spends their money, it is theirs, make it their own. And looks like they are working to do research.

Here is some videos from the 2021 SEMA BDS Suspension Build where they took a Black Diamond and made an off-road fire truck

https://blog.bds-suspension.com/?p=25176

 

[AMTRV]

Oh really? You mean the U14 had extra bracing? Please divulge.

Don’t believe it dId. It was a very different design and materials.
Do you think the roll bar was engineered into 6thgens for looks?

 

[BigMeatsBronco]

Don’t believe it dId. It was a very different design and materials.
Do you think the roll bar was engineered into 6thgens for looks?

Nope, the #1 reason it's there is for REAR passenger safety. Common sense. Secondarily, it does add to the stiffness of the body, not the Frame, as the roll bar is NOT directly attached to the frame.

I no longer have rear passengers!!!

By this logic "every single pickup ever made should have a roll bar in the back or the frame will buckle".... pure hogwash. And the fact that the two-door Bronco has almost half the bending leverage compared to a 6 or 8 ft pickup bed frame. Plus I don't have any reason to be hauling a 1500 lb payload in the back of my 4 ft bed pickup.

Lastly, the way the rear suspension supports the load on the rear coilovers, that are canted at an angle forward, is a design that completely eliminates the force on the rear of the frame behind the rear axle.
Nearly 100% of the weight on the rear axle is attached to the frame 6 to 8 inches ahead of the rear axle.
This fact alone eliminates any of the frame twisting or body movement that you were describing of or have wishful thinking for. Anything behind the rear frame coil spring mounts are just hanging in the wind, and NOT very intragal to the structure of the rest of the truck.

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