Ford Bronco Raptor and 2 APG ProRunners Take on Gold Mountain

[APG]

We went out for a fun run in the rocks in Big Bear, CA with two APG ProRunner builds and a Bronco Raptor. The ProRunner's are on 40" Nitto Trail Grapplers, Ultimate Dana 44's up front, Dana 60's in the rear, and of course they are both running our fully carbon fiber wide body system. The Raptor was stock with some 37" Nitto Trail Grappler's. It was a great day and we all enjoyed the great weather.

Keep an eye on our Youtube channel because we also took this same crew to Johnson Valley for some high speed off road comparisons. Video coming next week!

Also, for a full tour of the Black/Red Bronco, check our last video!

Sponsored

 

[Ford Motor Company]

We went out for a fun run in the rocks in Big Bear, CA with two APG ProRunner builds and a Bronco Raptor. The ProRunner's are on 40" Nitto Trail Grapplers, Ultimate Dana 44's up front, Dana 60's in the rear, and of course they are both running our fully carbon fiber wide body system. The Raptor was stock with some 37" Nitto Trail Grappler's. It was a great day and we all enjoyed the great weather.

Keep an eye on our Youtube channel because we also took this same crew to Johnson Valley for some high speed off road comparisons. Video coming next week!

Also, for a full tour of the Black/Red Bronco, check our last video!

Looks like an awesome adventure, thanks for sharing!

 

[Felix808]

You guys are early, Big Bear Bronco Bash is next week.

Looked like a good time .

 

[GlueBoy]

Whoop and rock eater.

 

[userdude]

What, no 2drs?!? lol Was hoping to see that white pro runner out there.

 

[TeocaliMG]

I understand you have the appropriate brackets to run the panhard nice and level even with the lift and travel, but did you consider doing a triangulated linkage?

I would be curious to hear your thoughts on the pros/cons.

Obvious con is needing to weld on the axle, but arent other aspects of this kit already weld on?

Are there concerns about the lateral stiffness of a triangulated set up with the available package space?

Looks awesome regardless, thanks for sharing!

 

[mattymik]

If I had the money, it would be APG over Braptor all day long.

 

[Montana Bronco]

If I had the money, it would be APG over Braptor all day long.

Agree 100 percent.

 

[Defyfate11]

We went out for a fun run in the rocks in Big Bear, CA with two APG ProRunner builds and a Bronco Raptor. The ProRunner's are on 40" Nitto Trail Grapplers, Ultimate Dana 44's up front, Dana 60's in the rear, and of course they are both running our fully carbon fiber wide body system. The Raptor was stock with some 37" Nitto Trail Grappler's. It was a great day and we all enjoyed the great weather.

Keep an eye on our Youtube channel because we also took this same crew to Johnson Valley for some high speed off road comparisons. Video coming next week!

Also, for a full tour of the Black/Red Bronco, check our last video!

Would like to see one of the ProRunner's adopt a modified (Dana 60 and longer axle tubes requires modification) Rock Krawler Pro-X 4 link rear setup, not sure if the bump stops would interfere with providing the additional flex, even if so, be interesting to see what differences are noted between the two driving in city and highway.

 

[Thurmy7]

A nice little bit of John Bull bonus towards the end too. Can't wait to get back up there.

 

[StinkBug]

I understand you have the appropriate brackets to run the panhard nice and level even with the lift and travel, but did you consider doing a triangulated linkage?

I would be curious to hear your thoughts on the pros/cons.

Obvious con is needing to weld on the axle, but arent other aspects of this kit already weld on?

Are there concerns about the lateral stiffness of a triangulated set up with the available package space?

Looks awesome regardless, thanks for sharing!

I won't speak for them or their reasoning, but I wouldn't have chosen a triangulated setup either. While Triangulated 4 links have their advantages off-road, they sacrifice quite a bit of stability on road and generally require a lot of sway bar to keep things under control. A parallel 4 link with panhard is generally a lot more stable and predictable. Making pretty broad statements here, with a lot of asterisks, but a lot of people don't really understand the pros and cons of different link suspension setups.

 

[TeocaliMG]

I won't speak for them or their reasoning, but I wouldn't have chosen a triangulated setup either. While Triangulated 4 links have their advantages off-road, they sacrifice quite a bit of stability on road and generally require a lot of sway bar to keep things under control. A parallel 4 link with panhard is generally a lot more stable and predictable. Making pretty broad statements here, with a lot of asterisks, but a lot of people don't really understand the pros and cons of different link suspension setups.

Thats kinda what I was getting at regarding the lateral stiffness. Stability bars are easy enough, but getting all the triangulation out of one pair could be tough to satisfy all the desired attributes. Partly why i'd like to see a unified upper control arm, but that has its own limitations for positioning the hardpoints.

 

[StinkBug]

Thats kinda what I was getting at regarding the lateral stiffness. Stability bars are easy enough, but getting all the triangulation out of one pair could be tough to satisfy all the desired attributes. Partly why i'd like to see a unified upper control arm, but that has its own limitations for positioning the hardpoints.

I wasn't talking about the axle locating stiffness, I was talking about the body control issues and torque roll under power. I once built a Samurai buggy with a Toyota 4 cylinder that would lift the left front tire off the ground if you floored it in a left hand turn, and it had about a third the horsepower of the bronco. The 3 link with wishbone upper setup I think you're talking about has all the same roll control issues that a triangulated 4 link does, only a bit worse, and has the added down sides of lower strength and more difficult packaging. Another down side I didn't mention for the broncos is that the upper link on the right side already basically goes through a notch in the gas tank. So where do you put your fuel when the whole tank is in the way of the new suspension setup?

 

[APG]

Great points above, both descriptive and mechanically correct. We looked at all options when originally studying the architecture of the car, what kind of car we are building, who we are building it for, and how the car is intended to be used. As APG's suspension is now, we have no articulation limitations via links/joints or in the wheel envelope/body throughout the travel path, and very little lateral shift when cycling. And i think its safe to say we have best in industry performance. We landed the same place as the oem. We just improved the geometry and spec'd everything to work as a complete system (as does an oem) without any of the other drawbacks of single purpose design. Really the problems happen when one does not consider the packaging of the other components and simply changes one component at a time. You guys know your stuff, thanks for the positive conversation.

 

[BigMeatsBronco]

I won't speak for them or their reasoning, but I wouldn't have chosen a triangulated setup either. While Triangulated 4 links have their advantages off-road, they sacrifice quite a bit of stability on road and generally require a lot of sway bar to keep things under control. A parallel 4 link with panhard is generally a lot more stable and predictable. Making pretty broad statements here, with a lot of asterisks, but a lot of people don't really understand the pros and cons of different link suspension setups.

You can have a triangulated, 4 link and still keep the Panhard rod. The isuzu Vehicross was built that way. And the factory rear suspension was better than the bronco is today, and that was 25yrs ago. The suspension was designed by Lotus, Had more articulation and wheel travel than the bronco and also a better ride ....They even came with remote reservoir shocks. pic is with completely stock shocks on 35s!!!

They did run a tiny sway bar on the rear.

My preference is a triangulated three link , Where are the upper arm is fashioned similar to an front a-arm, with only a single joint at the axle center. I've had several four wheel drive vehicles that came this way from the factory and I believe they handled the best both off road and on road. The suzuki sidekick/geo tracker had one of the best suspension designs That i've seen come from any factory... By simply adding longer shocks and springs, twenty inches of wheel travel was easily possible with the factory, arms and joints!!!

Sponsored