Full B&O sound system upgrade(Update)

[ilostmydrink]

Thanks for the thorough response! You have way more knowledge on all of this than I do!
Im beginning to wonder if the C2s were the right choice

Are the kick speakers that much of an improvement after replacing them? Ive gone over multiple build guides and it seems 50/50 on if its worth it.

I've made a lot of mistakes!

Don't worry about the C2s, they'll sound great. Just protect them through the DSP software and you'll be good.

If you're trying to understand frequency and the sound associated with it, I definitely recommend playing with this site: https://onlinetonegenerator.com/ and reviewing the Interactive Frequency Chart: https://alexiy.nl/eq_chart/

With respect to the kick-panel speakers, I think you're going to have to do something with them. The kick-panel speakers receive a high power output at 150 watts RMS. I don't think the stock B&O speaker will handle that power.

Audio systems are a mesh of compromises. Going back to the kick-panel example earlier, my selection of the Memphis Audio MJP6 means the subwoofer has to play up to a higher frequency of 100 Hz. The wider frequency response set for the speaker requires more power from the amp. Similarly, setting your C2's to 300 Hz instead of 600 Hz for the crossover point requires more power from the amplifier.

The MPJ6's sound pretty great - the kick drum can hit so hard with them it makes you nauseous - but I'm actually about to pull those out and replace them with the Hertz C165L and some deadening in an attempt to limit the high bass from the subwoofer while also moving away from that 48 dB slope: https://hertz-audio.com/product/c-165-l/

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[Dk0ta]

I've made a lot of mistakes!

Don't worry about the C2s, they'll sound great. Just protect them through the DSP software and you'll be good.

If you're trying to understand frequency and the sound associated with it, I definitely recommend playing with this site: https://onlinetonegenerator.com/ and reviewing the Interactive Frequency Chart: https://alexiy.nl/eq_chart/

With respect to the kick-panel speakers, I think you're going to have to do something with them. The kick-panel speakers receive a high power output at 150 watts RMS. I don't think the stock B&O speaker will handle that power.

Audio systems are a mesh of compromises. Going back to the kick-panel example earlier, my selection of the Memphis Audio MJP6 means the subwoofer has to play up to a higher frequency of 100 Hz. The wider frequency response set for the speaker requires more power from the amp. Similarly, setting your C2's to 300 Hz instead of 600 Hz for the crossover point requires more power from the amplifier.

The MPJ6's sound pretty great - the kick drum can hit so hard with them it makes you nauseous - but I'm actually about to pull those out and replace them with the Hertz C165L and some deadening in an attempt to limit the high bass from the subwoofer while also moving away from that 48 dB slope: https://hertz-audio.com/product/c-165-l/

Okay, so definitely order some new 6.5s then if I’m going this far in already.

Would the C2 650x be good for the kicks? I know not everything in an audio system needs to be the same brand but I am weird and lean towards matching everything. But if that’s not the best route I am not attached to that idea.

I looked at the specs of the C2 650x https://www.jlaudio.com/products/c2-650x-car-audio-speakers-c2-coaxial-systems-99618 as well as the specs of the hertz you are switching to and I am definitely out of my league when reading them and trying to figure out what will serve me best.

I do like some solid punchy bass but I also like a clean sound. I primarily listen to some country and occasionally edm/rap.

again, huge thanks for all the help, I appreciate it. I was just gonna yolo it but I would prefer to do it “right” the first time.

 

[ilostmydrink]

Okay, so definitely order some new 6.5s then if I’m going this far in already.

Would the C2 650x be good for the kicks? I know not everything in an audio system needs to be the same brand but I am weird and lean towards matching everything. But if that’s not the best route I am not attached to that idea.

I looked at the specs of the C2 650x https://www.jlaudio.com/products/c2-650x-car-audio-speakers-c2-coaxial-systems-99618 as well as the specs of the hertz you are switching to and I am definitely out of my league when reading them and trying to figure out what will serve me best.

again, huge thanks for all the help, I appreciate it. I was just gonna yolo it but I would prefer to do it “right” the first time.

For sure, don't want others to fall down the rabbit hole I have unless they want to! Staying in the same brand is generally a solid idea as they've created a series of speakers meant to work together.

I don't want to steer you the wrong way for this but generally a coaxial speaker is not chosen for this location as the tweeter will not be used.

To explain further, you need to understand that you're building a stereo (two channel) system. In an ideal world, you'd have only two point based sound emitters in this system with no surfaces to reflect off of and they'd cover the full range of frequencies from 20 Hz to 20 kHz. Additionally, the listener is stationary and equidistant from the emitters.

The result there is that all sound would reach the listener without reflection interference and within phase and time alignments.

When the point sources are placed inside an enclosed space (like the Bronco), hard surfaces within the vehicle (such as the windshield, windows, center console and dash) reflect sound in a way that creates filtering, nulls or peaking. If you're unfamilar with the concept, the easiest visual is imagining waves in a pool. Sometimes the waves bouncing around inside the pool makes a huge peak or a huge valley in the water. The same happens inside a vehicle with sound. Note that this is sometimes why people omit the center channel speaker when doing audio upgrades.

If you somehow split those two point sources into four point sources, with two sources playing from 20 Hz to 10 kHz, and two point sources playing from 10 kHz to 20 kHz, ensuring the sound reached your ear at the right time is important. When items are out of time alignment it can result in the nulls or it sounds like an echo (especially true for the rear speakers in the Bronco).

What you're building right now is a 4-way stereo system that generally covers the the following (reference the Interactive Frequency Chart):

• Subwoofer: Sub Bass and some Bass
• Midbass woofer: Some Bass and Some Midrange
• Midrange woofer: Most Midrange and Some High Mids
• Tweeter: Some High Mids and High Frequencies

In a coaxial speaker the Midrange Woofer and the Tweeter are combined into one speaker. The manufacturer has already set the crossover of the tweeter with the midrange woofer based on the speaker characteristics.

Depending on the size of the Midrange woofer (e.g., 6.5" or 8") in a coaxial speaker the Midrange woofer can also covers the range of the Midbass woofer. If you have a coaxial speaker in the kick-panel you run the risk of affecting the sound coming from the dash because you have two source points generating the same frequencies.

Thus, in many times the kick-panel is relegated via crossovers to not overlap the dash-panel speaker frequncies. That doesn't mean the C2 650x can't perform the function in this location; it's full range just isn't going to be used.

With the current MJP6's I have in the vehicle, the kick-panel speakers are primarily responsible for 100 Hz to 300 Hz, while the dash speakers are responsible for 300 Hz to 20,000 Hz. I'm hoping to widen the kick-panel band to 80 Hz to 640 Hz, and raise the dash speakers from 640 Hz to 20,000 Hz. The expanded kick-panel frequency will move the crossover out of the really critical frequencies of 500 Hz and below.

At the bottom of the forum are some links to other people's fantastic work on installing their sound system and some of the sound deadening used. Highly recommend browsing through theirs to understand dampening material and if it is worth it to you.

I have also kept my center channel speaker in the mix while using mObridge's algorithm for the stereo sound. It drops the gain of the center speaker quite a bit but absolutely helps filling the transition between the left to right channel naturally.

 

[Dk0ta]

Update;

I installed the JL 8w1v3 in the factory sub box as well as the mobridge. Relatively straight forward but i took my time to ensure i didnt break any clips and got everything sitting properly.

I ordered some mjp6's for the kicks but unfortunately they are on backorder.

I also completely killmat the cargo area and the sub box as well as put some polyfil in the box.

In the mean time, i havent really messed with the DSP software as im completely lost.

I emailed fraser to see if he could help me with a starting point with a tune.

I used the Preset 4 that came with the DSP which was labeled as "Multi seating/Surround" it sounds good however i am not getting much in the way of bass. I wired the Sub with both positives going into the post as well as both negatives going into the negative post. It is definitely working as i can see and feel it move, it just seems underpowered. Hopefully i wired that correctly.....

(EDIT)

Sub is working fine, i guess it wasnt enabled in the DSP

 

[Timo]

Okay, so definitely order some new 6.5s then if I’m going this far in already.

Would the C2 650x be good for the kicks? I know not everything in an audio system needs to be the same brand but I am weird and lean towards matching everything. But if that’s not the best route I am not attached to that idea.

I looked at the specs of the C2 650x https://www.jlaudio.com/products/c2-650x-car-audio-speakers-c2-coaxial-systems-99618 as well as the specs of the hertz you are switching to and I am definitely out of my league when reading them and trying to figure out what will serve me best.

I do like some solid punchy bass but I also like a clean sound. I primarily listen to some country and occasionally edm/rap.

again, huge thanks for all the help, I appreciate it. I was just gonna yolo it but I would prefer to do it “right” the first time.

My brain won't wrap around that either. It's like have mismatch
brands of tires.

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