Sliders - why are there virtually no frame mounts?

[BC overlanding]

Why only welding? Virtually no one in a Jeep welds the sliders on, they are nearly all bolted. Nothing wrong with drilling and bolting to the frame. And yes, still lots of room in the aftermarket for Bronco accessories.

I was always told between the 2 welding was stronger. My Tacoma has bolt on sliders and I have never had a problem. If they come up with bolt on solution I would go that route but personal won't be drilling into my frame. Each to there own

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[goatman2]

I was always told between the 2 welding was stronger. My Tacoma has bolt on sliders and I have never had a problem. If they come up with bolt on solution I would go that route but personal won't be drilling into my frame. Each to there own

Either bolting or welding works. Welding is permanent, and does effect the strength of the original material though it would likely never be close to enough to matter. Bolting doesn't effect the strength at all, partly because the bolt is filling the hole and the bolt tension should make it stronger than it was before without the hole. If we ever wanted to change to a different slider, or sold it and someone wanted something else, or we bent up the slider and needed to replace it, bolting is much better. Like you said, each to their own.

 

[R11]

This guy explains why based on their discussions with manufacturers at SEMA. Skip to the 1:00 mark.

was about to post this, only discovered it the other day myself! Vibration issue is interesting, but I’m no engineer!

 

[BC overlanding]

Either bolting or welding works. Welding is permanent, and does effect the strength of the original material though it would likely never be close to enough to matter. Bolting doesn't effect the strength at all, partly because the bolt is filling the hole and the bolt tension should make it stronger than it was before without the hole. If we ever wanted to change to a different slider, or sold it and someone wanted something else, or we bent up the slider and needed to replace it, bolting is much better. Like you said, each to their own.

Very good point

 

[AlpineDescent]

People under-estimate the strength of the pinch seam on the vehicle - remember that in a uni-body, it serves as the frame. The lateral support arms for the frame mount also create pockets where you can hang up on - instead of nice longitudinal sliders, you have now created lateral catch points. In the photos above, I would not call those "sliders" (regardless of what the manufacturer says), they are strong running boards.

 

[Razorbak86]

People under-estimate the strength of the pinch seam on the vehicle - remember that in a uni-body, it serves as the frame. The lateral support arms for the frame mount also create pockets where you can hang up on - instead of nice longitudinal sliders, you have now created lateral catch points.

I honestly don’t think having rock sliders mounted to the body instead of the frame is a big issue.

Brad Lovell, Champion AMSOIL off-road racer and vehicle designer, who consulted closely with the Bronco design engineers during the project development, said that the factory rock sliders were designed to be mounted to the body, and he seemed to prefer it that way.

For what it’s worth, Brad’s brother, Roger Lovell, who co-founded Lovell Rock Racing with Brad, is a structural engineer and plays a key role in their own vehicle design and fabrication, so I’m pretty sure Brad was on the lookout for mechanical design issues during the development phase.

Also, food for thought, there is a good chance that the rocker panels are made of a high strength steel (e.g., Fortiform 980 GI grade).

Excellent point.

Conversely these parts might remain intact and hold their shape long past when another part would be damaged beyond repair…

I was thinking that if the rockers on the big bronco are also boron, and they are performing well, that might be why ford felt comfortable attaching the sliders to them.

Interesting thought. I did some digging and located the following information about the Fortiform 980 GI grade steel. Note the rocker panels highlighted in the Applications diagram at the bottom.

https://fordauthority.com/2020/10/f...as-sole-gen-3-steel-supplier-for-2021-bronco/

https://www.bronco6g.com/forum/thre...rld-to-use-fortiform-980-gi-grade-steel.6706/

https://automotive.arcelormittal.com/products/flat/third_gen_AHSS/fortiform

 

[Jr87mustang]

No doubt it is a strong area. Its when you come down on a rock with enough force on the slider is where you will see a difference. A frame mount slider that is hit hard does not damage the body of the truck. A body mounted slider that gets a hard enough hit will push the slider into the body causing damage/dents on the rocker area below the door. It is just an area that has more give than something like the frame.

Here is an example of a Jeep that had body mounted sliders. The area it is attached to is strong but it still caused damage.

 

[Teke]

P&P Engineering is working on a set of bolt on sliders.

 

[AlpineDescent]

No doubt it is a strong area. Its when you come down on a rock with enough force on the slider is where you will see a difference. A frame mount slider that is hit hard does not damage the body of the truck. A body mounted slider that gets a hard enough hit will push the slider into the body causing damage/dents on the rocker area below the door. It is just an area that has more give than something like the frame.

Here is an example of a Jeep that had body mounted sliders. The area it is attached to is strong but it still caused damage.

But in this case, they are trying to use running boards (side steps) as a rock slider. You have a lot of leverage on the outside edge of these which is why they bent up and hit the body. The Ford Factory sliders are right beneath the pinch seam and would not do this. The factory sliders are a harder steel and are there to prevent a point load from a rock bending or scraping away the pinch seam. What I am hoping to see is reasonably priced side-steps that clamp onto the factory slider and can be easily removed when going off-road (the few I've seen are over priced or leave brackets that will catch up on rocks).

 

[Silver-Bolt]

But in this case, they are trying to use running boards (side steps) as a rock slider. You have a lot of leverage on the outside edge of these which is why they bent up and hit the body. The Ford Factory sliders are right beneath the pinch seam and would not do this. The factory sliders are a harder steel and are there to prevent a point load from a rock bending or scraping away the pinch seam. What I am hoping to see is reasonably priced side-steps that clamp onto the factory slider and can be easily removed when going off-road (the few I've seen are over priced or leave brackets that will catch up on rocks).

For sliders to truly be functional they have to extend out past the body. That is the only way to prevent the obstacle from damaging the body. The slider are meant to be sacrificial in order to protect the body.

 

[GreenMtnBronco]

But in this case, they are trying to use running boards (side steps) as a rock slider. You have a lot of leverage on the outside edge of these which is why they bent up and hit the body. The Ford Factory sliders are right beneath the pinch seam and would not do this. The factory sliders are a harder steel and are there to prevent a point load from a rock bending or scraping away the pinch seam. What I am hoping to see is reasonably priced side-steps that clamp onto the factory slider and can be easily removed when going off-road (the few I've seen are over priced or leave brackets that will catch up on rocks).

overpriced for sure!

 

[Aonarch]

Just like the Wrangler and Gladiator, pretty much all of the sliders are body mounted.

They seem to all be plenty strong even for most off-roaders.

Another thing to think of, the body will move a bit versus the frame, not a lot, but a bit, so there would have to be plenty of clearance in mind.

Frame mounted would probably require drilling, which is a big no no for DIYers.

 

[GreenMtnBronco]

Frame mounted would probably require drilling, which is a big no no for DIYers.

watch the video posted above and see the comments, a lot of MFGs have avoided frame mounts because of the electrical running through the frames..

 

[Daktari]

The lateral support arms for the frame mount also create pockets where you can hang up on - instead of nice longitudinal sliders, you have now created lateral catch points. ), they are strong running boards.

that was my first concern when I saw those posted a while ago (plus the crappy welding). They lower clearance and create nice bars to hang up on rocks and keep you there. If you happen to slide and get a good rock in between those bars, good luck getting going again. Would need extra armor plates in between those arms, even more weight and places to catch and keep dirt and rust. Not convinced by that design.

I'll be using my stock sliders and should be fine, but I'm also not into crazy rock garden crawling, I'd get some dedicated "don't care if gets beat up" rig for that, not a new truck.

I do want side steps that are easy to remove for wheeling, but they have to be reasonably priced or I'll just have to deal with the climb in, not all that bad.

 

[LOD Offroad]

watch the video posted above and see the comments, a lot of MFGs have avoided frame mounts because of the electrical running through the frames..

Where is there electrical inside the frame? I've seen the electrical harness and break lines on the outside of the driver side but thats it.

We are currently in development for frame mounted sliders and belly skid plates. Hopefully prototyping here in the next few weeks.

This frame is especially challenging!

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