Swapping Infinity for Morel - Rear pods

[Brian_B]

So I have the Mabett 6.5" rear pod replacements. I have (had) Infinity REF-6522ix 6.5" in the kick panels and the rear pods. I have Infinity 4032cfx in the dash panel.

Overall I liked the sound, but you have to give them some power. I have a 50Wx4/500W 5 channel Kenwood amp, so it's something more than the OEM head unit (non-B&O). They would sound a bit thin at lower volumes.

Out of curiosity, I decided to see how the Morels sounded, so I got a set of Tempo Integra 602's and threw them in the rear pods.

The Infinities were coax with a tweeter, and have a "tweet boost" button on them that I never used. The Morels are not exactly Coax but are listed as 2-way. Other key differences: The Infinities are 60W speakers at 92db sensitivity, the Morels 120W at 90db sensitivity. The Morels cost 5x more than the Infinities, so I don't want to gloss over that.

I was hoping that the Morels would give me a bit more "umph" at lower volumes. They have had some pretty good reviews overall, and on these forums as well.

I've got limited time on them - just got them installed today. But so far:

Yes, the Morels are a bit richer at lower volumes. However, at higher volumes, they seem like they are distorting whereas I never noticed that on the Infinities. It's almost like I'm driving them with too much power, but for a 120W speaker I can't push more than 50W to them, and I didn't notice the same distortion with the Infinities. I don't think it's amp clipping, it definitely sounds like speaker distortion.

Now - I'm talking like, up to almost max volume - something I never normally listen at. But it's still a difference I was not expecting. It could be the wiring isn't as clean as it was on the Infinities, although I'm using the same Metra harness and soldered connections. Could just be something with the amp settings - I haven't went back in and retuned the amp for the new speakers.

Not sure if I'll keep them or not - I have 60 days to figure it out I guess. I'll give them a week or so and see how it settles in. I do know that returns on audio gear aren't exactly linear - you very rarely get something that sounds better to the same degree that it costs - so I'm not exactly expected 5x better sound. Will have to give it a few days to see what I think.

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[BigJ2]

Funny you’re in this dilemma, I’m questioning something similar. I’m looking at ditching my JL C2 setup and was heading towards Morel. I’m not mad at the JLs, but they just aren’t doing anything special for me.

 

[gerby151]

You should check the signal going to the speakers with an oscope to see if it is clipping, which is a common issue when you are at the upper range of a lot of sources. This is more than likely your issue since you should not be close to pushing the max rating on those speakers. Also the higher the sensitivity rating, theoretically the higher the volume (all things else being equal) which is probably why you did not experience higher volume with the switch. It does seem like you did get better sound and you would expect that since the Morel should be a better speaker.

 

[jabrax]

I could be wrong, but doesn't attempting to push high powered speakers without enough juice cause that issue

 

[Brian_B]

I could be wrong, but doesn't attempt to push high powered speakers without enough juice cause that issue

Could be - you are right.

 

[MNBigfoot]

 

[Brian_B]

A few more days with them installed.

I did decide to keep them in. They are notably clearer than the Infinities were. It's not nearly the same difference from going from the OEM to Infinity was, but it's notable none the less. I do not think I will upgrade my kick panels, although I may consider my dashs at some point in the future (when my bank account can support it)

I think @jabrax is correct about the distortion - it's just my amp can't quite push enough power to these bigger coils. And it's at a level that I don't listen to them at anyway, so I decided to not worry about it. They get plenty loud for me as it is.

Now - the cost issue. The Infinities that I had in there cost me about $80. These Morels are closer to $350. It's a matter of what your budget and tastes are. There is no denying the Morels sound better, but if you are just looking for an inexpensive upgrade over OEM, the Infinities are a way better value. In the audiophile world, one thing seems to hold constant - you can always find something that costs more, and to get better sound, the cost goes up exponentially as you step up that ladder. The Morel is a step up that ladder compared to the Infinities.

 

[jabrax]

I plan to try the same experiment. I am thinking about the Morels also. I currently have Focal 100 in the dash. After a first pass with tuning, they sound much better. I have to play very loud to combat highway noise when windows are down. Yes, it is a big difference in price. That will definitely be in the mix when deciding to keep or not.

 

[Brian_B]

I have to play very loud to combat highway noise when windows are down

That’s kinda my benchmark too - enough to hear clearly on the road with the top and windows down. But not so loud I need to wear hearing protection.

 

[Brian_B]

So coming back to this. That fuzzy blown speaker sound never really got better. It usually only hits at high volumes (20+) - I don’t usually listen to anything nearly that loud so I thought I could just live with it, but over time I’ve found that certain music styles can trigger it too - like low sustained notes on an acoustic guitar - and that can happen at low volumes.

Thinking of either swapping them to the kick panels and putting the Infinities back in the back, or just pulling them out and selling them off. If it’s just a lack of power then nothing wrong with the speakers…

 

[Brian_B]

So... continuing here

I pulled my Morels out of the rear pods, checked everything out. One of the (-) posts was a bit lose, but not off. Tightened everything up, switched left and right, and re-installed them.

That same day, I went ahead and ordered as set of Infinity REF607 speakers, anticipating that I was going to end up swapping them out.

But... the fuzzy speaker sound did get better. I haven't noticed it since - so maybe that's all it was - a poor connection on one of the posts.

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Anyway, the 607's showed up earlier this week. They are pretty much the same thing as the 6522s that I had before, only these are the component version instead of coax. Since I had them, I decided to try that "midbass" theory that a lot of folks have about the kick panels (and if I have the issue with the Morels again, I can mount the 6522 coaxes in the rear pods).

I just installed the crossover box and the woofer, I left the tweeter out of the kickpanel all together. If you are just looking at them - the speakers look almost identical -- same magnet size, same mounting panels, maybe the cone material is a bit different, and doesn't have the hole in the center for the coax tweeter to go through... so I probably could have just bought a $40 crossover and gotten about the same result.

Anyway, I wasn't expecting too much. But, I will say, there was a difference. It was not huge, not worth tearing out the 6522s to only replace it with nearly the same speaker, but it was there and I'd be lying if I didn't admit there was a difference, no matter how slight. There is a bit more umph coming from the front - and its now enough to make your jeans start to move.

I suspect it's because with the Coax, you have a woofer and a tweeter in parallel. Now I only have a woofer, so that woofer is seeing a bit more power than it was before - more so than anything to do with "tweeter muddying up" the sound down there or anything. But I can't really prove that, that's just my suspicion after playing with it for a bit this afternoon. I'm not willing to clip the lead on the tweeter on the 6522 to test that, but I did play around a bit with connecting and disconnecting the tweeter on the 607 from the crossover, and the there was a difference in the woofer displacement.

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My big issue right now is that I have my dash speakers driven by the OEM radio, the kicks driven by Ch A the Kenwood X802, and the rears driven by Ch B on the X802. The only real option I have right now to adjust between the dash and the kick panel is to up the gain on Ch A. I have Infinity 4032's in the dash, and those are a pretty efficient speaker - so when they aren't in parallel with the kick panels, they get loud. So I have the CH A gain cranked almost to max to try to keep up with it. The gains are right now such that if I'm driving with a passenger, the volume level of 6 is plenty loud enough to hear the radio but still have a conversation, and 10 you can't hear each other talk any more. 15 will just about make your ears bleed, and 20 is ... way louder than I want to be in with the top on. Anything past that is more or less insanity, although I did take it up to 25 to check the Morel's out - everything hung without too much clipping, but you could definitely hear it down the road.

I ended up splitting the front channel out because in the factory parallel configuration I didn't have any adjustment between kick and dash at all. The dash speakers were a bit overpowering, especially since they redirect right off the windshield into your face. Now I have some adjustment, but the dash is still really strong, and I have everything cranked way up to try to match it.

So thinking on ways to get around that without throwing out the entire system or throwing more money at equipment again (my wife is starting to ask questions and my closet fill up with random stuff.... I say it's science). I think ultimately I need to just put a less efficient (or higher ohm, although it's odd to get one higher than 4 for auto) speaker in the dash to tamp it down... or break down and get an actual 8 channel amp (which I am avoiding because I don't want to mount it under the seat - the Kenwood fits under the dash nicely)

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