Mike Levine saying outright he does NOT care about Granger/Chapman/SAC

[long_road]

I'm trying to just kind of zen out about Levine's comments and the allocation nonsense. At first, I was mad... and even considered just cancelling my reservation, not giving Ford my money, and buying a Jeep instead. But then I really thought about it from "both sides" and kind of chilled out a bit. Plus, it's not like any other major auto manufacturer wouldn't do the exact same thing Ford is doing if they were in the same position. Huge demand, low supply of an outrageously popular new vehicle... of course you'd cater to your big dealers and of course those big dealers will gouge foolish customers for every penny they can get out of them.

I'm in the Charlotte, NC area. When the reservations first started, I called around to a handful of local dealers and got the same no-commitment response on pricing. One did say they'd "likely" honor MSRP, but wouldn't sign off on it. Then I saw the posts on this forum about the under invoice pricing and jumped on board. In a place like Charlotte, people are stupid and pay too much for everything. Heck, in the uppity neighborhoods they're proud to tell people they paid too much for stuff. It makes no sense to me. I bet there's some jerk out there with an Outer Banks bragging about how he paid $20k over MSRP for it. Hard to fault dealers for making maximum profit when you have idiot consumers out there dropping down $60k, $70k, $80k for a $40k vehicle.

But I'm not that consumer. I'm a guy who's willing to wait it out and shop around to find a good deal. The trade-off to that is... I won't be getting mine for a while.

I applaud the dealerships like Stephens (who I'm with) for offering a deal on a vehicle they well knew they could have sold for more. Ford's shenanigans are what they are. If I make the cut for a 2022, great. If I'm waiting around another year, fine. I guess I'll get a 2023 then. Who knows.

What I do know is, from now on... when I plan to buy a new car, I won't just browse around near me and go play the shady dealer games at whatever dealership in my area has a vehicle on their lot that I want. I'll call up a place like Stephens and say, "Hey, this is what I'm looking for. Can you get me one?"

I'm so willing to take a road trip out of my area to spend my money at an honest dealership that communicates well and is good for their word. I may never get a Bronco from them, but I'll sure do my best to give Stephens my future business for whatever I end up buying.

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[OmahaKevin]

Capitalism is great, Ford can choose to tilt the playing field any way they can to maximize profits or to be spiteful to a subset of their dealers.
Unfortunately what works the best financially is not always the best way to build a "Lifestyle Brand" which Ford has stated is their goal. They don't have a clear concept of what they want and it shows in this disaster of a launch.

Ford gets the same money no matter what the dealer sells it for. Maximizing profits would be keeping the most enthusiastic customers happy so they become good brand ambassadors.

 

[Heath Aggen]

I remember in 2003, I special ordered the coveted 1st gen Rubicon (still have it). I looked all over and could not find what I wanted and dealers were charging 10k over sticker if you found one at all. So I started calling around and finally talked to a knowledgeable sales person at a small east Texas dealer. He suggested just ordering one, he would sell it to me at 500 over his cost. I asked why he would do that, he said a sold order for a Rubicon gave him an allocation for 2 more Rubicons he could put on his lot and he was happy for the buisness. 4 months later on Christmas eve, it showed up and was in my garage for Christmas morning. Those were the days.
So after reading thru this exhausting post I am trying to understand the issue, because never in the history of car sales ,as far as I know, has a sold order impacted a dealers allocation for stock units. Am I to understand that because I placed my order with a small dealer that may be allocated 50 broncos, my order takes away from that total, so if I am number 51 of their orders, I won't get mine, is that right? That makes no sense for Ford or anyone. It also means that a small dealer just won't process orders that may take away from their allocation. It also seems like levines comment was very snide because there is no way 98% orders were processed thru large dealers, but anyway.
I am sticking with my very knowledgeable and solid small town dealer with my highly constrained Wildtrack order because all I got is time. Hopefully it all works out, in the mean time the 04 Rubicon is still rocking the streets and trails occasionally, I must admit I don't offroad like I once did, but still love the vehicles. Cheers

 

[Atomicdog]

Ford gets the same money no matter what the dealer sells it for. Maximizing profits would be keeping the most enthusiastic customers happy so they become good brand ambassadors.

Short term, yes. Keeping their mega dealers happy and not selling/switching to Ford competitors makes them more money long term.

 

[OmahaKevin]

The big elephant in the room is the internet and social media. Technically, Granger isn't supposed to be targetting outside its sales area, and Granger would never break this rule by placing ads in California newspapers for example. Social media is much more grey because people can find and share Granger's deal and grant the dealer a national audience.

Big dealers in major metro areas have a lot to lose with this type of dealer capturing sales from what was once a captive market. Unfortunately, they also have the law on their side to pressure Ford into keeping them a small town dealership.

Dealers have been selling out of state for years. One in small town Nebraska has bragged for 30+ years about selling to all fifty states. They're now the #10 Ford dealer in the country while being in a town of 7,700.

 

[dgauss]

You place a retail order for a Wrangler and you have a VIN in 2-3 days.

Can't say enough about how great your people have been this week as I switched to a 392!

 

[gimlithepirate]

If I ordered a Bronco from Granger, I would have saved about $1400 off MSRP ($1000 off invoice and invoice is about $400 less than MSRP). I got an F-150 for $8700 off MSRP in April from my local dealer.

Granger's "deal" isn't earth shattering. The fact that they are transparent, and actually communicate with their customers is far, far, more important to a lot of folks.

By the time you add in shipping, some of Granger's customers will be effectively paying more than MSRP. But those customers chose to do so because of service and transparency. Zach has been completely up front with everyone this entire time. Just trying to talk with my local folks is... maddening.

Its a pretty great deal in the offroader world, as Tacoma/4Runner/Jeep/etc. don't tend to see these kind of discounts very often. Also majorly depends on your market. In NM, Grangers deal is insane, but our jeep dealers typically offer a max of 500 off MSRP. Most people I know drive to CO Springs to get a decent deal on an offroad oriented vehicle.

But yes, the transparency was as much the attraction as the price. Especially the strightforward no bullshit style of pricing.

 

[Sean D]

it's something that is made up to distract...just like the constant harping on parts availability. The bottom line is that allocating based 100% on number of reservations at a dealer violates no law, anywhere in the US.

@dweskamp, another BS strawman tactic to divert from the fact that Ford is in no way prepared to deliver on its promises to make and deliver 190K Broncos.

 

[mpeugeot]

Yes they did give other guidelines. They said ALL reservations would be built before dealer stock orders.

I kind of remember this being the words spoken/written more than once, or is my memory faulty?

However, if a dealer like Granger outsold their allocation, then they should have let their customers know, instead of banking hundreds of reservations they knew they could never fill.

You don't think that I knew that I was getting in the back of a very long line? You don't think that Granger didn't disclose that, there is proof of it on many threads in here.

I read they have 800+ reservations. That means even if they got double the allocation for 2022, there are STILL hundreds pushed out to 2023 or longer. I would never place an order with them if I was told this in advance. That begs the question, did they tell people that?

Yes, I was #956, now number #955 I guess with at least one transfer, who knows, maybe enough people will jump ship from Granger and I'll get my Bronco from them, but I am not going elsewhere.

So while you might never place an order with them, I did, does that make me the bad guy now?

Is it wrong if I am willing to wait on a dealer with integrity that values my business?

Granger has been forthcoming, open, and honest in every interaction across multiple staff members. That's way better than the experiences I have had with other dealers.

I think the title of this thread is a not a depiction of what he said and should be changed.

That's nice, but unfortunately, you didn't have it your way... Burger King is down the street.

The title does accurately characterize and paraphrase how it appears that he feels about the situation. His behaviors and messaging are leaving everyone with that impression despite his attempt to obfuscate the way he feels about it. Stop trying to change reality, Mike Levine sucks at his job.

 

[StedeBonnett]

I'm very careful with my personal social accounts with brands - due to I make a living at it. Anyways—I left a comment for his tone-deaf ears.

Mike's tweets go against everything I know from a PR perspective and how you handle damage control. I miss Scott Monty at Ford.

Back in the day—2007 as a matter of fact - I contributed to a grassroots effort to stop CBS from canceling Jerico (anyone a fan?).

It went down like this.

" When CBS canceled "Jericho," a show about life in a small town after several nuclear bombs go off across the country, its fans started to rebel.

Internet chat rooms -- including a popular one on CBS's own Web site -- filled with talk about how to convince the network to bring back the show.

One method: nuts.

So far, nearly 40,000 pounds of nuts have been sent to various network executives in New York and Los Angeles. That's about 8 million peanuts.

Now it looks like the outpouring of peanuts might be working."

Link: https://abcnews.go.com/Business/FunMoney/story?id=3214156&page=1


How about it folks? I'm willing to kick in $100 bucks or so?

 

[Evergreen]

I know there's plenty of pros and cons to each model, but this whole debacle really seems to make direct sales seem like a dream scenario.

 

[gammaguybronco]

Granger met with their Ford area reps in the summer of 2020 and put together their offer with Fords blessing. It was awhile ago so I don't have the direct link handy but I believe it is in the Granger October Special thread.

Grangetober was released only to increase the number of Broncos they would receive to their earlier customers that ordered. This was based off the original allocation. I went back and reread the original post after this news came out. I don’t blame Granger. They were just using the formula that was presented to them at that time to try and improve their standing in the eyes of Ford and help their customers receive their Broncos. This is completely on Ford and they obviously don’t care. Which, if I’m being honest, blows my mind.

 

[Carolina Jim]

People read and relied upon Ford's (repeated!) statement that reservations would be served first, and in order, and then went out to get the best deal they could.

The folks in the absolute worst position are those who didn't invest several thousand hours engaging with B6G. They still don't have a clue just how screwed they are.

Analogy: two people go to their first cricket match with no idea what the game is all about. One just eats popcorn (or the equivalent in India)...while the other sits next to a friendly cricket expert who narrates the match.

Ford and their distribution network created a total information void for people to navigate. IMO this is why Ford is an "also ran" company with a dubious future

 

[dbeyers]

Find me one local Ford dealer here in CO that is willing to commit to MSRP on a Bronco and tell you where you would stand in their orders/allocations. Until then, don't ride people for not supporting their local dealerships. There is a reason I flew to TX to buy my f150 and drive it home.

My Denver dealer is charging MSRP + $1200, he has 260 orders and has shown me my spot in line (not sure that they really know very accurately - so as a matter of conjecture its not super accurate, given commodity constraints). One might quibble with MSRP plus, but in the scheme of things ... ? (deducting for cost of flying, gasoline and time).

Try Phil Long ... I did not go with them, but as I recall they were MSRP + a bit less than I bit on.

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